Newviewphotos wrote:
Ive been on MM for more than a decade and I have seen the number of models decrease alot of the years.   Can anyone explain this? Is it thenindustry or the site or covid? But where did they go?

You know that Model Mayhem was never the home of most models here in the US or around the world, right? Or do you have some statistic that proves that MM was ever more than a small slice of modeling market.

Iona Lynn 2 wrote:
We spent so much time on set that we learned photography, opened our own photo studios for a decade or so then life changed & we found new opportunities. 

As it is now, most of the photography offers I receive are from new photographers who want to "trade" with me while I'm both modeling AND teaching them OR photographers want to work with brand new models and have them experience modeling for the first time.

As a result, I book fewer jobs each year, but the ones I do book are higher quality.

OR they're like me, where I know what I'm doing (yes, I may need to relearn some things since I haven't shot that much lately.. rest of post is why that is)us, but photography never worked out as a source of income. Now, I work retail and am on Social Security,  have all the normal bills that everyone else has, so when it comes to hiring models, I can't afford the $200-300 it takes just to hire them for a few hours. That's barely less than what I make per paycheck for 2 weeks of work

Nor-Cal Photography wrote:
Answer: Same place as where all the flowers have gone.
Response by the late, great Pete Seeger

I was thinking the same thing!

Loved the Kingston Trio version.

Photo Kyle wrote:
And that is why my portfolio is severely lacking, thus starting the vicious cycle "Need to have a portfolio in order to build a portfolio "

Wrong.  You need to have good networking skills and business organization to build a portfolio (& book paying clients)
Anyone who has been shooting a while can go through whatever they have shot, pull 9 images of a similar style they want to shoot, get those images out in front of people & get more people to model for them.

I started my very first photography portfolio with just a few friends, each friend told another two friends, until it snowballed into me being able to shoot anyone from newbies, to experienced models.

People waste too much time on thinking they need to improve their images when they need to improve their networking & booking protocol.

Photo Kyle wrote:
Even when the images are 10 years old? I have a port that everyone says is good, just whenever a shoot is discussed, it always starts with "Here are my rates." As for friends, we haven't lived in our current area very long to build up enough of a friend network. Not making excuses, just stating facts.

Yes even with old images.
What are you sending as your introduction message? How that message is worded is important.
The word NEXT is your best friend, don't make it a goal to get a yes, make it a goal to get 20 NO's a day.
Did you move yesterday? Length of time does not matter, you can find a networking event, gallery event, even a local bar or anywhere people gather, be charming & chat with people.

The core of the issue that many artists have on MM is they have no set project with no set theme, so they flounder just making one off photos that are all non related. that is a very hard sell.
Put together a core theme project concept and THAT is what you are selling to them....
Sell the project not the photos.

Photo Kyle wrote:
Even when the images are 10 years old? I have a port that everyone says is good, just whenever a shoot is discussed, it always starts with "Here are my rates." As for friends, we haven't lived in our current area very long to build up enough of a friend network. Not making excuses, just stating facts.

I would be happy to give a constructive critique if You post a Request in the Critique Forum

fotopfw wrote:
I'm retired and work with about 4 models a years now, just for the fun of it. I have no trouble getting models, they come back to me. Most models now are from the Ukraine, such nice and pro girls to work with!

Everyone knows Ukrainian models are the best.

Garry k wrote:

When I started my portfolio here I did so with a young unknown local fashion Model - I met at a Fashion Show .She was pretty and could pose like crazy but none  of the other photographers in my area had any interest in her because She was a skinny17 yr old without any curves .I was lucky to score a trade shoot with her and that shoot changed my life ..Since then Coco Rocha has risen to the highest heights of the Fashion World and I benefited from that by being able to shoot with a lot of  Local Models on this site ( back when there were a lot of Local Models on this site )

And through that process I learned how to become a capable Photographer

About 5 years ago , I found another young beautiful Model via a local Facebook Group . She was stuck in a contract with a with a small agency ( who allowed her to find her on work ) and I again saw huge potential in her ..I did a shoot with her and paid her $100(which included doing her own makeup ) and started my IG portfolio with her . Her name is Tessa Greiner and her success ( She is  now signed with Elite in LA ) has become my success again ( as many Models and Agencies in my region know of Her and her And  have followed her trajectory  )

Now I shoot mainly Agency Models (;which is good because MM has become pretty dead with respect to Model Action in my area ) I am able to shoot with about half the Agencies in my Area at this time - This keeps me as busy as I want to be with this hobby if mine .

I had about 6 good shoots over the summer but am taking a bit of a break now to work on My IG as it is about 2 yrs behind

Two points I would like to make in writing what I have . Good / Potentially Great Models are still out there…maybe not so much on this platform any more but on others ( and in the Real World ) and it is still quite possible to find that One Exceptional Model to build your Portfolio on ( If You shoot her properly ) and grow successfully from there

Edit

The Types of Models that You have in your Portfolio and How well You have photographed them can have a strong influence on other Models that You wish to work with

And paying a little money to the Model is simply a respectful thing to do

Photo Kyle wrote:
Even when the images are 10 years old? I have a port that everyone says is good, just whenever a shoot is discussed, it always starts with "Here are my rates." .

Apparently not everyone.

Your work has to have a value to the people you want to work with. No matter how good 'everyone' (whether that's a dozen, hundred, or ten thousand people) say your work is, if they're not the people you're trying to convince, it doesn't do you any good.

Francisco Castro wrote:
Model Mayhem USED to be fun for creatives.

MM takes itself too seriously.

I believe you are correct. Websites dedicated to creatives should not operate under severe restrictions. thefashionspot forums used to be jumpin. They had so many rules and ran there forums like a police state. Now their forums make MM forums look busy.

Francisco Castro wrote:
Model Mayhem USED to be fun for creatives. Since the new owners took over, it's pandered to mainstream conservatism.

Model Mayhem started in 2005. It was sold to Internet Brands 3 years later, in 2008. They've owned MM for the last 14 years.

At what point does someone stop being "the new owners"?

Newviewphotos wrote:
Ive been on MM for more than a decade and I have seen the number of models decrease alot of the years.   Can anyone explain this? Is it thenindustry or the site or covid? But where did they go?

If you are lucky to live smack in the middle of two big cities there are still ample models active. The only difference now they expect to be monetary compensated. The other option is to look to social sites like meetup, FB, and Instagram. There local interest groups there along with a few surprises.

Garry k wrote:

I would be happy to give a constructive critique if You post a Request in the Critique Forum

The last time I asked Garry to critique my work, he was so brutally honest that I closed my studio and moved out of the country.  I am just giving you a fair warning.

Kevin Connery wrote:
Model Mayhem started in 2005. It was sold to Internet Brands 3 years later, in 2008. They've owned MM for the last 14 years.

At what point does someone stop being "the new owners"?

When they sell it to others, then Internet Brands becomes the old owners, and the new owners become the new owners.

However, Internet Brands, if I'm not mistaken, has undergone changes in ownership after 2008. Making those new owners of Internet Brands the defacto NEW owner of MM.

Green Wave Photo 312 wrote:
And models don’t need produced shoots for content anymore. I know a popular OnlyFans model who shoots all her own content and says the more diy it looks the more her followers like it.

Also, anymore on this site beginner models with just a few selfies think they should be paid for test shoots.

You are correct on both points. I know many Onlyfans models and they all say the same thing "my fans want BTS style cell phone pics and videos not professional looking photo sets". This is not me asking if they want to shoot and this is their response, this just comes up in conversation.

On the second point most beginner models already have an Onlyfans so shooting for free seems crazy to them. A photographer telling them "yeah but my stuff looks like magazine quality" doesn't hold the same weight it used to. The response will most likely be " what's a magazine?" and " my cell phone pics look as good as anyone else's on Instagram so that's good enough. "

More troubling for me is that models now want pay, all photos edited and unedited, and approval rights on what gets posted and where.

Francisco Castro wrote:
Model Mayhem USED to be fun for creatives. Since the new owners took over, it's pandered to mainstream conservatism. Conservatism is the antithesis of creatices, who, by their very nature, want to create NEW art and push the boundaries. By pandering to conservatism, they (the owners) put the people that gave MM life, the creatives, into boxes, limiting them to rehashing old ideas that fit a profile.

Models are still around, just not on MM. Instragram, Snapchat, Tik Tok, allow for more creative expressions. They're fun. And fun is where people will go.

MM takes itself too seriously.

THAT THAT THAT AND THAT.

Kevin Connery wrote:
Model Mayhem started in 2005. It was sold to Internet Brands 3 years later, in 2008. They've owned MM for the last 14 years.

At what point does someone stop being "the new owners"?

If you haven't noticed, MM has been shoving the app (poorly designed and barely functioning) down our collective throats. Because that app is in the app store, they have HEAVILY censored this entire site through it. There is now some weird algorithm to where if you uploaded a picture of a cat, they would censor it and you have to get it adjudicated. THAT is how ridiculous it is around here. In fact, when I bothered to question it, someone went through my entire portfolio and censored every image but three. Because the app is so awful, if you communicate through it to someone using the website (like me) I will never see that message unless I keep track of how many replies are there. It is all for $$$ on their end.

I do believe that answers your point and explains Francisco's further. *curtsy*

Newviewphotos wrote:
Ive been on MM for more than a decade and I have seen the number of models decrease alot of the years.   Can anyone explain this? Is it thenindustry or the site or covid? But where did they go?

Simple.  Overall the landscape has changed and the bulk of "models" have started photographing and video recording themselves.   The question has always been - why do they need a photographer?   Models have a better chance at making enough money to pay their rent each month using social media as opposed to trying to land consistent traditional (and relatively low-paying) modeling jobs with publications, etc..   Those days are over and models finally woke up and smelled the coffee so-to-speak...   you don't need a photographer for the kind of work that constantly pays.... although for non-photographer models, the content can look much better if you do.

Think of it this way.  Most people here can't fly themselves from point A to B in an airplane when they want to.  Why?  Because  (1) they don't own a plane (2) because they don't have a pilot's license and any applicable requisite training demanded by the aircraft they're flying.     However, what special training does a model need to take compelling photographs for social media / web site, etc.?   None.   A decent camera, lens, lighting and video cam are the preeminent   factors, and that's not hard to come by.

So.... if Jack can be a photographer.   Why can't Jill be one for herself?

That's (at least in part) is what you're seeing play out on a large scale world wide.

Model Sarah wrote:
If you haven't noticed, MM has been shoving the app (poorly designed and barely functioning) down our collective throats. Because that app is in the app store, they have HEAVILY censored this entire site through it. There is now some weird algorithm to where if you uploaded a picture of a cat, they would censor it and you have to get it adjudicated. THAT is how ridiculous it is around here. In fact, when I bothered to question it, someone went through my entire portfolio and censored every image but three. Because the app is so awful, if you communicate through it to someone using the website (like me) I will never see that message unless I keep track of how many replies are there. It is all for $$$ on their end.

I do believe that answers your point and explains Francisco's further. *curtsy*

MM hasn't been shoving anything down anyone's throat.  It's not for everyone and everyone doesn't frequent the site.  It's that simple.  If you like it enough to stay then so be it.  If you don't, the door is there for you to use.  You're not entitled to have the site run to your specs...  as with anything, when it stops fitting your needs, go somewhere else and frequent a site or product that does fit your wants, needs and or spec.

If the site becomes too much for me to bear (like any other product or site) I just leave.  It's too simple and easy.  No one puts anything down your throat ... especially when you're standing there **voluntarily** letting them spoon feed you.