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Touch me not Models
agreed I can't see myself I rely on the photographer to help me out with a little tweeking.. Sep 27 11 08:00 pm Link Artemis Bare wrote: lol gross Sep 27 11 08:02 pm Link Everyone has their own comfort zones, I don't understand what the big deal is. Sep 27 11 08:06 pm Link I usually try to give direction, but occasionally I'll quickly ask "Permission to touch?" and on an affirmative make the adjustments needed. There really are times when picking a model up and moving her are a lot easier than saying "move x to y and a to b while keeping m at n." Sep 27 11 08:09 pm Link I remember seeing in a profile here something along the lines of "Yes, those are my hands in the photos. If you don't like being groped then please don't contact me.". IIRC he wasn't short of takers. Different strokes ... Sep 27 11 08:13 pm Link I seldom touch the models during a shoot, but when I need to I always ask them 1st, and every time, before I touch them... even if they have given me permission to do so just a minute or two before. I don't see a problem with touching them if needs be, for the shoot, but if the model has had a bad experience in the past then I say respect her wishes.. or shoot with a different model and skip her. Sep 27 11 08:16 pm Link Put on glove and use a long stick so that if you do need to adjust anything (hair, move the arm around, etc. on the model, use the stick to pin point..  Some model would definitely find this insulting but if they insisted on no touching policy, then the stick is the best alternative. Anyway, always ask make up artist/hair stylist to do the adjustment. Avoid any physical contact with model is the best policy. Sep 27 11 08:17 pm Link hartcons wrote: Yup, I with you here. My wife adjusts when needed. The only time I've touched a model was when they shake my hand after the shoot. Sep 27 11 08:26 pm Link Shiva Photo wrote: Yes, this is a problem for blind photographers. Sep 27 11 08:30 pm Link AJScalzitti wrote: First, thank you for drawing a distinction between Hobbyists and GWC's. Sep 27 11 08:41 pm Link - serious photographers don't "touch" their models, but adjust the “subject” Sep 27 11 08:46 pm Link If a model isn't comfortable with the photographer posing her, she shouldn't be shooting with that photographer. It is necessary at times, I agree. Sep 27 11 08:48 pm Link Artemis Bare wrote: I work with a lot of novices, and for bodyscape and figure work especially, it's much easier for everyone to just make the adjustment. Naturally, I ask first. Sep 27 11 09:00 pm Link so hence a mud or hairstylist shouldn't touch as well, seriously, i been doing this for a living for 23yrs. if i need to adjust something i will tel the model, or after a few times of saying, left, no up down etc, i just say hold on and adjust head hand or leg, and no no groping or any other crap aside form getting the desired feel for the shot. that is the deference of a professional and amateurs, but that being said, in general i think if the model can't get it ,then it is okay for some one on set or the photographer them self to adjust.of course some models. have a the feeling that they know aqll they ere angeles and to a degree they do but still there isn't a moment that they still need some adjustment as well. its basically called professionalism. Sep 27 11 09:14 pm Link I just use a cattle prod. Sep 27 11 09:15 pm Link Glenn WC wrote: You shoot models with big knives; I assume you behave: Sep 27 11 09:17 pm Link Artemis Bare wrote: .....NEXT ! Sep 27 11 09:20 pm Link I wouldn't touch a model without asking first, of course. I have noticed lately that it's usually the model's foot that needs moving. I wonder why that is. I've found myself saying "May I move your foot?" quite a lot. But then after all this not touching, sometimes when I go to help her off the posing stand, a model will jump naked into my arms. It really made a difference when I elevated the stand a couple of feet. Sep 27 11 09:31 pm Link 1. I have a lot of ways I can pose a model. Most of them don't involve touching the model. I do what works. If the model either has made it clear "hands free zone here" or we haven't worked together before and she's probably still wondering if I'm a dirty old man, I make it a point to keep my distance. 2. Most of the time I don't think touching is necessary. There are a couple of models I work with you have made it clear that they don't mind if I position them with my hands when I feel it necessary. Just did a shoot with one of them--I don't think I adjusted a hair or moved a foot once--but we both agreed that option was there I felt I needed it. However we were both in-sync, my instructions and examples were clear and there was just no need. 3. Frankly, some photographers rely on touching b/c they can't communicate clearly enough (i.e.: not so good with the words) and/or the model isn't so good with getting verbal instruction or translating the example (such as a photo or drawing). 4. And yes, there are plenty of models who feel compelled to put up such caveats b/c they have been groped (and I"m sure the photographer then replied "don't be so paranoid--I was just positioning you!"). Ed Sep 27 11 09:34 pm Link Shiva Photo wrote: Agree... Sep 27 11 09:42 pm Link I don't think it's appropriate if the photographer just walks over and touches the model. But if s/he tells the model how they should be posing, and the model can't get it herself, the photographer can ask if they can help and adjust the model themselves. The model should generally be fine with that. I don't want *anyone* just touching me without asking though, not just photographers. There's times you're in a complicated pose, and moving to adjust your hair/bra strap/etc will just mess up a different part of the pose. I'd rather hold the pose and have the photographer adjust something. A MUA/hair or wardrobe stylists is good for that if they're present, too. I had a photographer tell me to NEVER let a photographer touch me, even if I didn't understand the pose and they asked me if they could help. I thought that was a little extreme. Especially because he was giving me strange posing advice that wasn't making much sense to me, and instead of helping, he'd just give up. Sep 28 11 12:49 am Link There are MM models, internet models, and agency models. Not that many really cross the lines, yet it's likely that some photographers do. Hence their mention of such crazy actions. I rarely shoot other than agency models so I may too be offending the rare MM model when I shoot. Yet frankly I couldn't give a shit. I'm in it to make pictures, and good ones. If I have to physically insist it's for a reason. That reason is surely my lack of verbal communication. Mea culpa. Yet everyone wants strong pictures, so if it is such a blockage then shoot with those who are afraid to do so, or communicate better. Edit, forgot, agencies models will never ever say something if you help pose them. Yet there lies the reality of being professional on all sides. Sep 28 11 01:03 am Link Neil Snape wrote: I don't think part of being a professional includes letting people touch you without asking. That's a personal thing. Sep 28 11 01:23 am Link Shiva Photo wrote: It's all about what your intentions are. Sep 28 11 01:30 am Link Modelmayhem has a lot of pervs who are really good at taking photos, and love to use that skill to touch girls coochies. Sep 28 11 01:30 am Link Augustine York wrote: Gross... I don't touch underwear a model is wearing (Sorry.. personal thing here, don't care if other people will or do).. Sep 28 11 01:39 am Link I just simply refuse to work with anyone who has issues. Its always best to avoid a bad shoot, a real waste of time. Sep 28 11 01:40 am Link I have 3 rules when shooting. 1. Do not touch the models. 2. Do not touch the models. 3. Do not touch the models. I agree that there my be times when it is necessary, like getting up from an awkward pose, but always ask first before you offer assistance. Case closed. Sep 28 11 01:41 am Link Wysiwyg-NN wrote: Sep 28 11 01:44 am Link Alabaster True wrote: It is not like someone is going to walk right up and bend you into shape. When working on a shot there is dialogue, everyone is trying to get somewhere, and there is always direction given before ever touching a model. Sep 28 11 01:45 am Link Artemis Bare wrote: and she is a Navy vet so she has been to exotic ports. Sep 28 11 01:50 am Link I usually work with a very good female MUA and she does the adjusting more often than not - her eye for that sort of thing is almost as good as mine. Sometimes a quick adjustment by me is required, though as many have pointed out, announcing your intention beforehand usually prevents any misunderstandings: "I'm going to touch your face; there's a stray hair across your eye..." "I'm going to adjust your dress/clothing here and here..." etc. etc. Models who object to being touched under any circumstances are possibly in the wrong line of work... Sep 28 11 01:51 am Link I strongly disagree with the OP. Some people (people, not models) just don't like being touched under any circumstances. It would be counter-productive to touch one of these people; if the model's uncomfortable the shots will be bad. Personally I think it's very rude to touch anyone without permission under any circumstances. I extend my hand and wait for it to be shaken, I don't just grab other people's hands willy nilly. "Permission" can be very subtle and isn't always verbal, but it still must be given. I would react very badly to a photographer coming up and adjusting my hair or clothing without asking first. I react very badly if my MUM adjusts my clothing without giving me any warning whatsoever. Just taking 2 seconds to ask is courteous IMO, and is part of treating a model like a person rather than a walking clotheshorse. Sep 28 11 01:51 am Link Tansy Blue wrote: Like I said: maybe time for a change of career... Sep 28 11 01:54 am Link Tansy Blue wrote: RKD Photographic wrote: Is it wrong that she want's to be asked before a photographer touches her? Sep 28 11 02:00 am Link Fiera Photography wrote: Tansy Blue wrote: Is it wrong that she want's to be asked before a photographer touches her? It was the 'under any circumstances' bit I was referring to...and to the walking clothes-horse bit: fashion models in particular are just that and very little more until they become 'known faces'...as evidenced by the very high turnover in the industry. Sep 28 11 02:02 am Link Meh, I'm not a fashion model. I am wrong in every single way for fashion modelling. Internet modelling and agency modelling are different beasts. Accepted standards of practice are different between the two. How many serious fashion models book the majority of their client work on the internet...? I still don't think it's okay to touch someone (so invade their personal space) without getting permission first. But that isn't a modelling thing; it's a general courtesy I would extend (and expect to be extended) to all people. I don't think touching is wrong under any circumstances; I think that touching without permission (can I say non-consensual touch?) is never okay. Permission can be very subtle and isn't always verbal, but it must be given. (Personally I would argue that it's better to get explicit verbal permission, but failing that just giving the model 2 seconds warning - so that she's got a chance to object - suffices. Sep 28 11 02:15 am Link Tansy Blue wrote: OK we're on the same page then... Sep 28 11 02:23 am Link RKD Photographic wrote: Agreeing on things high-five! Sep 28 11 02:27 am Link I have to ask, why does anyone need to touch the model using both hands and without asking? The very few times I guide by touch I use two fingers and tell the model before touching them that I need to touch them to adjust the pose slightly. I think handsy photographers give the whole industry a bad rep. I am not saying the op is handsy, but I also think the op misunderstood the models bio statement. There is a lot of "show me on the doll" touching that happens and she is trying to head the pervs off at the pass. Sep 28 11 02:32 am Link |
