Jay Farrell wrote:
Safety excuse translates to, too lazy to research and do your homework, and dump the responsibility on someone else who may negatively affect the shoot.

It's so easy, we have the Internet to do that!   Aw hell!  What'd we do before the Internet?   Oh gosh!  People actually talked on the phone, wrote letters and met up with each other in person!  With the Internet to help in checking people out, in combination with the traditional methods of communication, we are actually safer today than ever.  Yes, "Lazy" is a good word to describe those who don't take the time.   I still have no problem with invited guests ... as long as I can check them out, and they know that I could ask them to leave at any point.  In 30 years time, I've been kidnapped once by two women posing as a "model & escort" and I've had to chase one uninvited guest away.  No other drama other than that is a pretty damn good track record!   I could teach a lot of you folks how to reduce the chances of "flakes" happening too! 

Patrick Walberg wrote:

It's so easy, we have the Internet to do that!   Aw hell!  What'd we do before the Internet?   Oh gosh!  People actually talked on the phone, wrote letters and met up with each other in person!  With the Internet to help in checking people out, in combination with the traditional methods of communication, we are actually safer today than ever.  Yes, "Lazy" is a good word to describe those who don't take the time.   I still have no problem with invited guests ... as long as I can check them out, and they know that I could ask them to leave at any point.  In 30 years time, I've been kidnapped once by two women posing as a "model & escort" and I've had to chase one uninvited guest away.  No other drama other than that is a pretty damn good track record!   I could teach a lot of you folks how to reduce the chances of "flakes" happening too! 

LOL! Yea so with the conveniences of the internet, that should make it easier to research! I still remember one model brought these 2 idiots with her....a couple of wannabe ghetto saggers. This was about 7 years ago and I was a little more lenient about it.....not much though. I had them sit in the living room and left my 2 Boxers in the house with them. And my white Boxer did not like saggers, so they had to sit there, while we were in the garage / studio shooting. She never brought them again

DVP Photography wrote:
Here's an issue I haven't seen mentioned and it has happened to me a number of times.  Model calls an hour or two before the shoot and says she can't come because her escort has bailed on her.  Very frustrating and a real waste of time.  An escort never has the same interest in the shoot as the model and can easily have something better to do come shoot time.  For this and other reasons already stated I only allow escorts for under 18 models and a real newbie that I really want to shoot.

Very real. I mentioned it on page 2....it doubles the risk of cancellation, not good.

Jay Farrell wrote:
Safety excuse translates to, too lazy to research and do your homework, and dump the responsibility on someone else who may negatively affect the shoot.

Or it means, "I'm just here for the cash and will shoot with every Joe Blow with an extra Benjamin in his wallet.", Rather than being picky and shooting only with established professionals - even for pay.

Krisna Fretwell  wrote:

I didn't write about escorts in a previous thread. Someone decided to spin what I was saying into something entirely different. Please read things thuroughly before jumping into a conversation. Thank you

Oh I read it all thoroughly and it doesn't matter how it got spun because you made your feelings on the subject abundantly clear and by the responses you knew how the industry, in general feels. So why start a thread on it...did you expect a different result?

Michael Pandolfo wrote:

"As for bringing an escort.. That is a safety issue and I will not by any means compromise my safety."

That was a quote by you in that other thread where you justify your many demands. So, yes, you did write about escorts in a previous thread.

That thread was about being rude and asking if it was necessary to be. And people were attacking that I had requirements. I did not write about escorts tho I commented on someone else about my requirements.

DVP Photography wrote:
Here's an issue I haven't seen mentioned and it has happened to me a number of times.  Model calls an hour or two before the shoot and says she can't come because her llama herder has bailed on her.  Very frustrating and a real waste of time.  An llama herder never has the same interest in the shoot as the model and can easily have something better to do come shoot time.  For this and other reasons already stated I only allow llama herders for under 18 models and a real newbie that I really want to shoot.

Very common - happened to me twice - the other issue and the one that finally broke the camel's back for me so to speak, was the llama herder (boyfriend) getting bored sitting by himself in a dark corner of the studio out of the way (I told her to make sure he brought a book as it's not my job to entertain the hangers-on) and leaving over an hour early, taking the model with him...

Mike Adams Photos wrote:
Just another "model" to never even consider....

It does separate the wheat from the chaff, doesn't it? Although it's less of an issue for me in that most of the drama emanates from the far side of the Atlantic - all the European models I've contacted through MM for shoots (bar one in Holland - I think she underestimated the travelling distances involved) have shown up willing, ready and able...

...and without escorts.

Krisna Fretwell  wrote:
Hi.... Just trying to understand the opposing side of it I suppose

I'm against them.

However, a mutually respected extra person there who is committed to the outcome of the shoot is fabulous. This could be the person who does make up, hair, or styling.

I've met one recently though that was zero help, (was a distraction and brought the shoot down.) She seemed to be there to promote herself her friend as a model and not help the shoot. At least her friend/assistant had the wherewithal to actually speak to me rather than upsell herself to everyone else at the shoot, (from my own casting call.)

From, that situation I learned that not everyone who invites themselves to a shoot should be allowed, at all. Better yet, I also learned to say, "Here are your things, you need to leave now, thank you, good bye."

Biggest factors in who is there is if they are committed to the outcome of the shoot and if they are able to help.

Jen

Ken Marcus Studios wrote:
What a great idea for a forum discussion . . . .

Out loud chuckling...smiling, thanks!

Krisna Fretwell  wrote:
Hi. I've heard controversy on escorts. Some say they're a smart idea and others say they're not. (Personally i won't go without one because of past experiences) but what is your take on it? Just trying to understand the opposing side of it I suppose

To me, an escort is just a potential thief wandering around my house.

Hi_Spade Photography wrote:
My view on "escorts" is...if you need a "escort" then you're not mature enough or smart enough to figure out how this buisness works, therefore you should stay in the sandbox until you can figure it out.

I recently hosted a couple traveling models and not all the photo sessions they setup had convenient public transportation.  Some photographers wouldn't pick them up and drop them off.  So I did drive the models to some shoots only if the photog would let me stay until the session was over.  Some of these no escort  guys came across as real deadbeats.

rxz wrote:

I recently hosted a couple traveling models and not all the photo sessions they setup had convenient public transportation.  Some photographers wouldn't pick them up and drop them off.  So I did drive the models to some shoots only if the photog would let me stay until the session was over.  Some of these no escort  guys came across as real deadbeats.

So photographers who don't allow escorts and don't play taxi service to models who set up shoots with no way to get there are deadbeats? That's a new one.

Krisna Fretwell  wrote:
Hi. I've heard controversy on escorts. Some say they're a smart idea and others say they're not. (Personally i won't go without one because of past experiences) but what is your take on it? Just trying to understand the opposing side of it I suppose

I tell models, do NOT work with anyone you have not properly vetted.

to do so only puts your "escort" at risk.

I don't care how bad ass you think your escort is, if someone wants to do harm to you they just kill your escort first.


work with reputable photographers only, your portfolio will thank you as well.

Patchouli Nyx wrote:

I tell models, do NOT work with anyone you have not properly vetted.

to do so only puts your "escort" at risk.

I don't care how bad ass you think your escort is, if someone wants to do harm to you they just kill your escort first.


work with reputable photographers only, your portfolio will thank you as well.

Escorts taste like chicken when skinned and grilled

Looknsee Photography wrote:
Escort Pros:
...  Model feels safe.
...  Escorts can be handy (holding reflectors, for example).

Escort Cons:
...  Escorts & models have been known to beat up & rob photographers.
...  Escorts can distract and/or inhibit models.
...  Escorts can draw model's focus away from the photographer / camera.
...  Escorts can become visibly bored, distracting the people working.
...  Escorts have been known to wander around, opening drawers, invading privacy.

Escort Strategies:
...  Check the escort's references.
...  Have the escort drop off the model, look around, leave, and come back later at
     an appropriate time to pick the model up.
...  But by all means, discuss the presence of an escort before agreeing to
      the terms of the shoot.

Tony Lawrence wrote:
Wow... you do all that?   I mean I know you check models references but escorts as well?   Gee that seems like a lot of work for a photo shoot.   I'd rather just not have them there.   I guess there may be some comfort that someone knew them if they are a problem but why have them there at all.

Absolutely right ...  that sounds like too much hassle for a shoot..    Work with talent that doesn't feel threatened.

Sorry to the OP that had a bad experience, that sucks when shit like that happens

Patchouli Nyx wrote:
I tell models, do NOT work with anyone you have not properly vetted.

to do so only puts your "escort" at risk.

I don't care how bad ass you think your escort is, if someone wants to do harm to you they just kill your escort first.


work with reputable photographers only, your portfolio will thank you as well.

Jay Farrell wrote:
Escorts taste like chicken when skinned and grilled

I'm desperately trying to restrain myself from a Silence of the Lambs quote.