kickfight wrote:

Keegan-Michael Key (Key & Peele)
Kevin Peele (Key & Peele)
Wyatt Cenac (Daily Show, etc)
Jaden Smith (Karate Kid remake, etc)
Dayo Okeniyi (The Hunger Games)

Just off the top of my head...

HOWEVER... I strongly recommend NOT making this about Cosby's race and/or making it a "black people" issue. This is about a famous person being accused of rape. Let's keep it about that.

The timing of the news is very odd, though. Right before Ferguson verdict.

Lovely Day Media wrote:

Why do alleged victims need justice? I'm of the opinion that only victims need justice (not that it helps them recover any) and the only way to actually make them victims is to find the alleged perp guilty in a court of law. Waiting 20-30 years to report these things doesn't exactly help do that.

so if a masked man jumps out of the bushes and steals my purse at gun point, and because I can't describe him he's never caught and doesn't have a trial, I'm not actually a victim of a mugging? Cool

People who are drugged and raped and don't know their rapists aren't victims
People who are threatened with their families, careers, their LIVES to stay quiet aren't real victims
Children who never work up the courage to tell the police they're being molested, or only find that courage as adults after the statute of limitations has run out aren't real victims
People who DO make it as far as court but get shitty lawyers, wound up with shitty uncaring investigators, shitty police who botched evidence, shitty doctors, etc etc and lose their case aren't actual victims

Laura UnBound wrote:
a bunch of really obvious logical moral true sane stuff

Yes.

Oh, now Lou Ferrigno's wife says he assaulted her back when she was a teenager at a party and his wife was in the next room. Story a few hours old.

Laura UnBound wrote:
so if a masked man jumps out of the bushes and steals my purse at gun point, and because I can't describe him he's never caught and doesn't have a trial, I'm not actually a victim of a mugging? Cool

People who are drugged and raped and don't know their rapists aren't victims
People who are threatened with their families, careers, their LIVES to stay quiet aren't real victims
Children who never work up the courage to tell the police they're being molested, or only find that courage as adults after the statute of limitations has run out aren't real victims
People who DO make it as far as court but get shitty lawyers, wound up with shitty uncaring investigators, shitty police who botched evidence, shitty doctors, etc etc and lose their case aren't actual victims

This wasn't my point. My point was a person who is a "victim" of a crime is a victim of a crime. Those who wait 20-30 years to report it aren't exactly helping the process and may be hurting it. 

Maybe my wording was wrong, but anyone can accuse anyone of anything, thus making them an "alleged victim". There is a difference between someone being the victim of a crime and the perp not caught or set free on a technicality or incompetence ... and a person being the "victim" of a crime and the "perp" not even going on trial because of their own misdoings (not reporting the crime until 30 years later, etc). Maybe that "perp" didn't even do it (or anything at all), but here in the US, a person accused of a sex crime is a sex offender whether they did it or not.

Sex offenders are pretty much the most hated people in the country and it doesn't matter if they were 18 with a 17 year old partner or a 65 year old preying on 3-5 year old children. They all get labeled as "sex offender", get put on the registry and made out to be the scum of the earth. This is assuming they are found or plead guilty to the charges. If they aren't found or plead guilty, the public will still think of them as a sex offender and their reputation is ruined for life.

Jim Ball wrote:

Did the concept of "innocent until proven guilty" go out the window because he is a celebrity?  From what I've seen so far, the accusers come across, imho, as a bunch of money-grubbers.

I never called the man a guilty rapist.  But certainly, something inappropriate happened.  Generally speaking, when someone is innocent of an accusation, they will defend their position when confronted.

Mr. Cosby has refused to even comment on it.  Except to say that he has no comment on it, and even his "no comment" was asked to be off the record.  It was enough for TV Land and NBC to pull his material from their channels.  Nobody wants to touch this guy now.  He's poison.

ANOTHER actress just came out and joined the heard saying something inappropriate happened.

It would surprise me if these people were seeking money.  Most of these things happened 20 years ago.  This is to right a wrong.  This is for vindication.  I would bet that most of these women blamed themselves for what happened for these decades.  Too afraid to say anything until the first came out of the shadows.

Look... I'd LOVE to believe that he's innocent.  If there was one person that I admired for speaking against the flow for the black community to help themselves, it was Cosby.  It will be a complete shame that another hero is retired in shame.

Somehow Morgan Freeman escaped that weird thing where he wanted to marry his step granddaughter.  Tiger Woods eventually recovered from his issues.  Better people have done worse.

We'll have to see how this plays out before you call me the judge, jury and executioner.  I am none of those things.

Good Egg Productions wrote:

I am quite certain a gaggle of well paid and highly expert lawyers have strongly advised him not to say a word !
Silence is not proof of anything.

Good Egg Productions wrote:
Mr. Cosby has refused to even comment on it.  Except to say that he has no comment on it, and even his "no comment" was asked to be off the record.  It was enough for TV Land and NBC to pull his material from their channels.  Nobody wants to touch this guy now.  He's poison.

In the interview, he looks so guilty.  Just wonder how many famous men whom we admire in our society did this type horrible thing to women because they have money, power and fame.

Connor Photography wrote:
In the interview, he looks so guilty.  Just wonder how many famous men whom we admire in our society did this type horrible thing to women because they have money, power and fame.

Like Christopher Columbus who never even stepped foot in America?

kickfight wrote:
I strongly recommend NOT making this about Cosby's race and/or making it a "black people" issue. This is about a famous person being accused of rape. Let's keep it about that.

Eastfist wrote:
The timing of the news is very odd, though. Right before Ferguson verdict.

John Photography wrote:
Thinking about this I was reminded of the Rolf Harris allegations.

In one a former makeup artist said while doing his makeup for TV he put his hand up her skirt and fingered her about for a few minutes.

Minutes? 

So she just continued working while this was going on?

Typically when presented with something shocking, like an assault, people operate one of three ways. Fight, flight, or freeze.


Yes, maybe she stood there and "let" it happen for a matter of minutes. It's fucking shocking, and confusing, and scary. People freeze up, their brains shut off/slow down so they aren't forced to process something absolutely horrendous and traumatic happening to them. Have you ever in your whole life been faced with something difficult like a confrontation with someone and you're so flustered that you just freeze up and do/say nothing? Maybe minutes, maybe hours later you're pacing your apartment and kicking yourself for not doing better, for not standing your ground, for not saying something, etc? You're wondering how the hell you just stood there and did nothing? You're upset with yourself for failing? Magnify that by a billion because you're being sexually assaulted.

Eastfist wrote:
The timing of the news is very odd, though. Right before Ferguson verdict.

was there a trial?

you stay nutty, mm.

and back to the original crux of these threads. a civil case has a far lower bar, as far as getting a verdict the plaintiffs would hope for. in all likelihood, there is a (monetary) settlement in order.

Laura UnBound wrote:
Typically when presented with something shocking, like an assault, people operate one of three ways. Fight, flight, or freeze.


Yes, maybe she stood there and "let" it happen for a matter of minutes. It's fucking shocking, and confusing, and scary. People freeze up, their brains shut off/slow down so they aren't forced to process something absolutely horrendous and traumatic happening to them. Have you ever in your whole life been faced with something difficult like a confrontation with someone and you're so flustered that you just freeze up and do/say nothing? Maybe minutes, maybe hours later you're pacing your apartment and kicking yourself for not doing better, for not standing your ground, for not saying something, etc? You're wondering how the hell you just stood there and did nothing? You're upset with yourself for failing? Magnify that by a billion because you're being sexually assaulted.

I can totally understand her doing that in that situation but it just seems incredible that that would even happen. I understand the whole "fight or flight" response thing, and yes have had confrontations where I hesitated before acting.  So yes I can see why the lady might not have done anything.

John Photography wrote:

I can totally understand her doing that in that situation but it just seems incredible that that would even happen. I understand the whole "fight or flight" response thing, and yes have had confrontations where I hesitated before acting.  So yes I can see why the lady might not have done anything.

I find neither people of higher status abusing those of lower status, nor people being abused not reacting exactly the way we expect them to in the time frame we dictate to be acceptable, incredible.

Which is sad. It should be incredible. It should be unheard of. But it's not.

Jim Ball wrote:

Did the concept of "innocent until proven guilty" go out the window because he is a celebrity?  From what I've seen so far, the accusers come across, imho, as a bunch of money-grubbers.

If Cosby is guilty of the charges, the statute of limitations has long run out on all of them.  Maybe he could spread a little money around to shut up victims that so far have not come forward.  The 15 or so that have come forward in the last week or so probably can't get any reward except the satisfaction of destroying the man who victimized them.  It isn't a small thing for Cosby to watch a 50+ year career as a beloved star of standup, television and movies swirl down the crapper and be exposed to the world as a creepy rapist.

Good Egg Productions wrote:
Morgan Freeman

The Morgan Freeman rumor (lie) was started by a single online article from The National Enquirer about five years ago. As everyone knows, that particular source is known for telling the most outrageous and ridiculous lies, based on nothing more than the twisted imagination of a sleazebag writer sitting at a desk, under pressure from his/her bosses to push the envelope of outrage and WTF.

The lie (based on nothing at all) was picked up by a handful of similarly sleazy lying online sources. When it came to the attention of more reputable news sources, they went directly to both Morgan and his step-granddaughter for interviews, and it quickly became crystal clear that there was no substance to the story. At all.

However, the internet being what it is and humans being what they are, "Morgan Freeman wants to marry his granddaughter, WTF!?", became an insidious meme which became quasi-immortal, and despite periodic attempts to kill it, it lives on, as evidenced by your post.

I'm just here to kill it yet again.

Long Live Morgan Freeman.

Laura UnBound wrote:
Typically when presented with something shocking, like an assault, people operate one of three ways. Fight, flight, or freeze.

ontherocks wrote:
my hair stylist got groped on her first model shoot. she didn't do/say anything at the time because she wasn't sure if that was normal for a model shoot.

how did we get to a point where people are unsure if sexual assault is normal? it's one thing to ask someone out, quite another to grope them without permission.

seems like parents, church and educational system are failing to teach some basics about life to our kids.

i vote for a new commandment: thou shall not finger (or stick your dick in someone's mouth which is today's allegation) without permission.

No. Officials ignoring rape claims and asking things like "what were you wearing" and "why did you lead him on" are what's teaching people that sexual assault is normal.

Wye wrote:

I look forward to the day when men routinely beat the bloody crap out of other men when they learn those other men mistreat women, the police evince little interest in doing anything about it, and when the men who got beaten complain about not getting justice, get told "you must have done something to deserve it" or "you're lying".

A guy can dream...

Damon Strong wrote:
Cosby's silence is deafening and makes him look guilty.  If I were accused of rapes that I hadn't committed I would be doing everything I could to defend myself publicly.

Defending yourself publicly doesn't make an iota's difference if it's outside the courtroom AND if you screw up just a little bit or some overly zealous reporter/news agent edits a sound bite, it can only make you look even more guilty.  If the prosecution gets hold of that edited tape, it's curtains for you because they have a tape of you saying _____ and you can't prove it's edited.

Lovely Day Media wrote:
Defending yourself publicly doesn't make an iota's difference if it's outside the courtroom AND if you screw up just a little bit or some overly zealous reporter/news agent edits a sound bite, it can only make you look even more guilty.  If the prosecution gets hold of that edited tape, it's curtains for you because they have a tape of you saying _____ and you can't prove it's edited.

Exactly. The first thing any competent lawyer will tell a client in any sticky situation is KEEP YOUR MOUTH SHUT!

Mad Hatter Imagery wrote:
Why do people keep accusing him of alleged improper behavior 20+ years afterwards? He is a beloved figure and certainly a better role model for young black men than they have these days. Nothing was ever proved and I assume no real evidence either. And when Janice Dickinson chimes in I feel I can only assume people are just after his money.

Don't confuse the loveable guy you see on TV with the actor. That's your first mistake. I'm curious how many people defending him in this thread have actually met Bill Cosby? I have...many times, and I can assure you, he's a piece of shit. When I heard the allegations about him raping people it truly didn't surprise me one bit. I've never seen Bill make any sexual advances to people but I've seen the way he talks down to others and how he is a rude, obnoxious jerk many times. That doesn't make him a rapist, but anyone who behaves as badly as he does, all the time, usually has other issues as well.

The latest development is that Lou Ferrigno's wife is now coming out against Bill Cosby. I know her also, and she's one of the most honest people I've ever met. She doesn't have a mean bone in her body and I've never once say anything bad about anyone...except Cosby. Now I know why. If it were her word against his, I'd take her side every day of the week and twice on Sunday.

Of course, nothing is proven in a court yet and this is all just speculation for water cooler discussions right now but my gut tells me Cosby is guilty as OJ.

Shot By Adam wrote:
Don't confuse the loveable guy you see on TV with the actor. That's your first mistake. I'm curious how many people defending him in this thread have actually met Bill Cosby? I have...many times, and I can assure you, he's a piece of shit. When I heard the allegations about him raping people it truly didn't surprise me one bit. I've never seen Bill make any sexual advances to people but I've seen the way he talks down to others and how he is a rude, obnoxious jerk many times. That doesn't make him a rapist, but anyone who behaves as badly as he does, all the time, usually has other issues as well.

The latest development is that Lou Ferrigno's wife is now coming out against Bill Cosby. I know her also, and she's one of the most honest people I've ever met. She doesn't have a mean bone in her body and I've never once say anything bad about anyone...except Cosby. Now I know why. If it were her word against his, I'd take her side every day of the week and twice on Sunday.

Of course, nothing is proven in a court yet and this is all just speculation for water cooler discussions right now but my gut tells me Cosby is guilty as OJ.

I don't consider myself defending Cosby. If he did it, he deserves whatever he gets and possibly more. If he didn't do it, he's still guilty in the public opinion and he'll still get what a person thinks he deserves. I do consider myself thinking of him as "alleged" at this point and will harbor no ill feelings toward him even if he did everything he's accused of doing.

He didn't do anything to me personally, and, if guilty, he didn't do anything to anyone I know.  People do all sorts of stupid things for all sorts stupid reasons. Killing or maiming them for their actions, IMO, doesn't fix anything and puts society in a place where those in the authority are doing the exact same thing they are "punishing" this person for doing.

Lock them up?  Okay ... whatever. Torture and/or kill them? No way ... not for me, anyway.

Shot By Adam wrote:

Don't confuse the loveable guy you see on TV with the actor. That's your first mistake. I'm curious how many people defending him in this thread have actually met Bill Cosby? I have...many times, and I can assure you, he's a piece of shit. When I heard the allegations about him raping people it truly didn't surprise me one bit. I've never seen Bill make any sexual advances to people but I've seen the way he talks down to others and how he is a rude, obnoxious jerk many times. That doesn't make him a rapist, but anyone who behaves as badly as he does, all the time, usually has other issues as well.

The latest development is that Lou Ferrigno's wife is now coming out against Bill Cosby. I know her also, and she's one of the most honest people I've ever met. She doesn't have a mean bone in her body and I've never once say anything bad about anyone...except Cosby. Now I know why. If it were her word against his, I'd take her side every day of the week and twice on Sunday.

Of course, nothing is proven in a court yet and this is all just speculation for water cooler discussions right now but my gut tells me Cosby is guilty as OJ.

Interesting.

Not surprising to me/instincts.

Curious though (if you choose to disclose) - what made him a piece of shit to you?

Eastfist wrote:

The timing of the news is very odd, though. Right before Ferguson verdict.

Damon Strong wrote:
Cosby's silence is deafening and makes him look guilty.  If I were accused of rapes that I hadn't committed I would be doing everything I could to defend myself publicly.

And making yourself look really guilty in the process.

If I were accused of something I was innocent of, wise folks don't even dignify BS with a response.

Damon Strong wrote:
Cosby's silence is deafening and makes him look guilty.  If I were accused of rapes that I hadn't committed I would be doing everything I could to defend myself publicly.

Cherrystone wrote:
And making yourself look really guilty in the process.

If I were accused of something I was innocent of, wise folks don't even dignify BS with a response.

Many years after the fact, just how does one prove he didn't do something?

ernst tischler wrote:

Damon Strong wrote:
Cosby's silence is deafening and makes him look guilty.  If I were accused of rapes that I hadn't committed I would be doing everything I could to defend myself publicly.

Many years after the fact, just how does one prove he didn't do something?

In our (the USA) system, he shouldn't need to prove he did not do anything wrong. Person is innocent until proven guilty, right? These people should prove that Cosby raped them - 20 years later.

Lovely Day Media wrote:
...and will harbor no ill feelings toward him even if he did everything he's accused of doing.

He didn't do anything to me personally, and, if guilty, he didn't do anything to anyone I know.

You hold no ill will towards rapists so long as they don't rape you or someone you love?

That's pretty much exactly what's wrong with society. It's so easy to sit on the sidelines of someone else's problems and not get involved/play Devils advocate/insist on the oftentimes impossible before you'll do something, because it didn't happen to YOU personally.

DCurtis wrote:
In our (the USA) system, he shouldn't need to prove he did not do anything wrong. Person is innocent until proven guilty, right? These people should prove that Cosby raped them - 20 years later.

Many types of assaults cannot BE proven. Is there a new type of rape kit that identifies tit and ass grabbing? Do you leave DNA when you molest someone over their clothes? Without a witness how do you prove you were anything besides penetrated? And even then, rape kits rely on dna, trace evidence, and visible trauma, if neither of those are present how are you going to prove it? Let's not even get into the part where real life is nothing like we see on law and order, we've got a backlog of thousands of untested kits, we botch investigations and fuck up evidence, we don't rush the lab for results in 12 hours so we can hurry up and catch our bad guys.

Laura UnBound wrote:

You hold no ill will towards rapists so long as they don't rape you or someone you love?

That's pretty much exactly what's wrong with society. It's so easy to sit on the sidelines of someone else's problems and not get involved/play Devils advocate/insist on the oftentimes impossible before you'll do something, because it didn't happen to YOU personally.

I couldn't agree more.

Jules NYC wrote:
Curious though (if you choose to disclose) - what made him a piece of shit to you?

He's a total opposite of what you see of him on camera. I was working backstage at some events spanning a few years and saw him frequently. He was a keynote speaker at some very large seminars around the world that I was working with and the regulars on the roster were Cosby, Larry King, Bill Clinton, Mikhail Gorbachev, Donald Trump, Steve Forbes, Richard Branson, and others. I had the opportunity to meet all of them many times. Before or after the speakers would go on stage we would do photo shoots with them with certain dignitaries or executives of the event promotions company or photos for promo pieces, etc. Everyone was always polite and kind and easy to work with except Cosby. He spoke well, and talked about his life stories and such on stage and the crowd loved him. The instant he was off stage he would bark orders, yell at assistants, and was crude to everyone who came in contact with him. I once heard him say, "Can we please hurry this stupid photo shoot up already? I'm really getting sick of hanging around here and want to be taken back to my hotel right now!" The only people who wanted to be around him were people who had never been around him before. The rest of us wanted nothing to do with the guy. The event had several security drivers to take the speakers to and from their hotels and even they once had to draw straws as to who took Cosby back to his hotel as nobody wanted to do it.

Shot By Adam wrote:
He's a total opposite of what you see of him on camera. I was working backstage at some events spanning a few years and saw him frequently. He was a keynote speaker at some very large seminars around the world that I was working with and the regulars on the roster were Cosby, Larry King, Bill Clinton, Mikhail Gorbachev, Donald Trump, Steve Forbes, Richard Branson, and others. I had the opportunity to meet all of them many times. Before or after the speakers would go on stage we would do photo shoots with them with certain dignitaries or executives of the event promotions company or photos for promo pieces, etc. Everyone was always police and kind and easy to work with except Cosby. He spoke well, and talked about his life stories and such on stage and the crowd loved him. The instant he was off stage he would bark orders, yell at assistants, and was crude to everyone who came in contact with him. I once heard him say, "Can we please hurry this stupid photo shoot up already? I'm really getting sick of hanging around here and want to be taken back to my hotel right now!" The only people who wanted to be around him were people who had never been around him before. The rest of us wanted nothing to do with the guy. The event had several security drivers to take the speakers to and from their hotels and even they once had to draw straws as to who took Cosby back to his hotel as nobody wanted to do it.

Thank you much for answering this. Isn't it ironic that the beloved 'nice, family guy' is such a self-absorbed ass.

Abusers (physical/emotional/sexual) can hide easily to the public behind closed doors. I am not saying being a jerk/ass makes you a rapist. It's just easier to hide when you manipulate the public, the 'outside persona' vs who you really are - celebrity/non-celebrity.

I do know that abusers have issues with power/control. It's all in the mix.

Jules NYC wrote:
I do know that abusers have issues with power/control. It's all in the mix.

Laura UnBound wrote:
You hold no ill will towards rapists so long as they don't rape you or someone you love?

That's pretty much exactly what's wrong with society. It's so easy to sit on the sidelines of someone else's problems and not get involved/play Devils advocate/insist on the oftentimes impossible before you'll do something, because it didn't happen to YOU personally.

My apologies, but I can't hate a person who is accused of doing something I have no first hand knowledge of. I'm not saying they shouldn't go to jail. I am saying people do stupid things sometimes and being haunted by these things for the rest of their life, to me, is wrong.

If they did something, get found guilty and sentenced to a $x fine and y amount of time in jail, then when the fine is paid and the time served, I think they should be left alone until and unless they decide to do it again, at which time the process starts over again.

I'm also not saying it's okay to rape. It's not okay (IMO) to do anything that's illegal or encroaches on someone else's rights. Someone a long time ago was smoking mad with me because some things went on, a little girl got killed and I said I didn't care. I didn't know the girl, her parents, anyone who knew any of them and had never heard of the city where she lived (though I live in the same state). They said I'm not human. I said people die every day. I can't care about all of them or I'd go insane or dead worrying about people I don't know, never met, likely would never have met and wouldn't know them if I saw them.

Cases come along all the time that media types sensationalize just so they can sell newspapers and advertising space. For instance, Scott killed Laci Peterson while she was pregnant. Does the outcome of that case affect my life one iota? Not at all. It's terrible that a pregnant young lady died with her unborn child but it has zero to do with me. I didn't do it and I wouldn't have done it. If she was so annoying that I wanted to kill her, leaving and divorcing her would happen long before.

I find that it does no one any good to harbor ill feelings toward anyone. If someone wants to do that, it's up to them and I won't try stopping them. It's their life to lose or shorten over things they have no power or control over.