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ontherocks
Posts: 23575
Salem, Oregon, US
if the allegations are true then the stand up thing would be for him to admit it and seek help/forgiveness. if the allegations aren't true (or they went along with it for the promise of fame/fortune) then those women are making it harder for other women to be taken seriously. either way it's a mess. regarding date rape drugs, how long do they stay in your system? seems like you would have to hit the hospital asap to get checked?
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kickfight
Posts: 35054
Portland, Oregon, US
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Laura UnBound
Posts: 28745
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
ontherocks wrote: regarding date rape drugs, how long do they stay in your system? seems like you would have to hit the hospital asap to get checked? Depends on the drug and the health of the person who ingests it. Most aren't inherently life threatening, you don't HAVE to seek medical attention if you've been drugged. Most people wind up in the hospital because someone around them notices they've been drugged and takes them, not because they were coherent enough during to take themselves in or willing to check themselves in after the fact.
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PhillipM
Posts: 8049
Nashville, Tennessee, US
Weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee I.B.T.L.
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John Photography
Posts: 13811
Adelaide, South Australia, Australia
Yeah that thread went well for a while then got locked and I got a moderator message about other people spoiling it.
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R80
Posts: 2660
Marceline, Missouri, US
I'd hate to believe it was true. As a kid, a buddy and I would rush out and buy his latest comedy record then rush home to listen to it, usually rolling on the floor in laughter as we did. Later, I watched him diligently in "I Spy" with Robert Culp. He built a reputation as being one of the few comedians to never use fowl language and later had that "fatherly image." Heck, I remember reading about him having a shit fit when the hot actress that played his daughter Denise, did a topless scene in a movie. (I'm gettin' old...can't remember her name right now.) I just saw tonight that TVland has canceled all upcoming reruns of his show and whatever he had in the works, movie or whatever, is gone.
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One Eye Blind
Posts: 547
San Martin, California, US
sadly, high visibility celebrities have real lives that are not always as glowing as their media appearance. This is not a new accusation against Mr. Cosby. A fact of life the real day to day world we live in today.
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MerrillMedia
Posts: 8736
New Orleans, Louisiana, US
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Kent Art Photography
Posts: 3588
Ashford, England, United Kingdom
We are going through a similar thing in the UK at the moment, with a variety of 'celebrities.' I have to say that I was very much on the fringe of the London scene back in the Seventies, so I knew a few celebrities and I had friends who knew people who knew people, etc. There were some creeps, I'll admit, but there were far more star-struck teenagers who would do almost anything to get near to people, or further their 'careers', or whatever, and there was usually more sex on offer freely than the drunk, drug-addled stars could ever handle. Some of the recent court cases in the UK make the Salem Witch Trials look fair and just, and I sincerely hope that the Bill Cosby incident isn't a sign that you guys are going to go through the same sort of thing that we are experiencing in the UK.
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Robb Mann
Posts: 12327
Baltimore, Maryland, US
The court of public opinion has already found him guilty. That may be the closest to justice his alleged victims ever get. I don't see anyone 'winning' here.
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Photography by Sean
Posts: 216
Atlanta, Georgia, US
Post hidden on Nov 20, 2014 04:47 am Reason: violates rules Comments: Soap Box is closed
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Michael Kerrek
Posts: 1427
Orlando, Florida, US
Post hidden on Nov 20, 2014 04:48 am Reason: other Comments: quotes hidden post
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Jim Ball
Posts: 17632
Frontenac, Kansas, US
When one of the accusers demanded money for an interview, it all became pretty clear to me.
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Mikell
Posts: 26693
San Francisco, California, US
Moderator Warning!
Soap Box is close and another thread on this subject was locked for going there Let's keep this one open.
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Lallure Photographic
Posts: 2086
Taylors, South Carolina, US
Unfortunately, the forum rules do not provide for adequate free speech, to answer your question.
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KelliOnLineGlamourNude
Posts: 2999
Barrie, Ontario, Canada
Mad Hatter Imagery wrote: Why do people keep accusing him of alleged improper behavior 20+ years afterwards? He is a beloved figure and certainly a better role model for young black men than they have these days. Nothing was ever proved and I assume no real evidence either. And when Janice Dickinson chimes in I feel I can only assume people are just after his money. I wouldn't say he's a better role model then the rest. If any of these allegations are true then he's no role model and there's plenty out there who are and have way more to offer.
Model
Melissa Kat
Posts: 401
Orlando, Florida, US
Mad Hatter Imagery wrote: And when Janice Dickinson chimes in I feel I can only assume people are just after his money. Definitely agree. If it really mattered they would had something RIGHT after it happened.
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DEP E510
Posts: 2046
Miramar, Florida, US
Always hard to believe when rich celebrities are accused of rape. Not only do they have a willing army of groupies to choose from, but they have their pick of top-flight world class escorts. According to stories I've read from stars, it is impossible to avoid eager offers of sex. They would have to climb over the eager groupies, just to find the ones who wanted nothing to do with them. Plus, Cosby is married... Not that marriage means much as far as sexual compatibility, but still... Hard to believe.
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ontherocks
Posts: 23575
Salem, Oregon, US
ok but if you think you are a drug rape victim shouldn't you zip to the hospital (or have someone zip you if you aren't coherent enough) for drug and rape tests? seems like it's much better to have some evidence so it doesn't become just he-said, she-said. Laura UnBound wrote: Depends on the drug and the health of the person who ingests it. Most aren't inherently life threatening, you don't HAVE to seek medical attention if you've been drugged. Most people wind up in the hospital because someone around them notices they've been drugged and takes them, not because they were coherent enough during to take themselves in or willing to check themselves in after the fact.
Model
Jules NYC
Posts: 21617
New York, New York, US
ontherocks wrote: ok but if you think you are a drug rape victim shouldn't you zip to the hospital (or have someone zip you if you aren't coherent enough) for drug and rape tests? seems like it's much better to have some evidence so it doesn't become just he-said, she-said.
There are many unreported cases of rape due to guilt/embarrassment/shame.
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Laura UnBound
Posts: 28745
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
ontherocks wrote: ok but if you think you are a drug rape victim shouldn't you zip to the hospital (or have someone zip you if you aren't coherent enough) for drug and rape tests? seems like it's much better to have some evidence so it doesn't become just he-said, she-said.
Yes, that would be better. welcome to victim blaming 101. Welcome to rape culture. Yes, they should go to the hospital, yes they should go to the police, no they don't always do that, no it's not so that they can make shit up or lie about it later. It's because they're hurt, and scared, and in shock, it's because they just had an unthinkable violent crime committed against them, they've been violated and it's probably going to scar them for the rest of their lives. they want to crawl into a hole and die, not go be questioned and poked and prodded and examined, making them feel even more violated and exposed. They're especially woried that people won't believe them, and a common feeling post-sexual assault is that it's the victims fault. You really don't see how maybe for the first few days post-attack when it's most crucial to gather evidence and file a report, it's also the most difficult times for the victims to do anything even remotely close to rational and clear-headed? They're busy going over in their head every second of every day what they could have done differently to not get raped. Seriously, teach yourself something about survivors before saying stupid things like "wouldn't it be a good idea to go to the hospital?" Yes, it would be a fantastic idea to get checked out and make sure they stay alive....except many wish they weren't alive after that. They don't want to sit in a hospital bed and have someone tell them they're lucky to be alive, or that they're perfectly fine now that they drugs have passed their systems, when they were just raped.
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Jules NYC
Posts: 21617
New York, New York, US
Laura UnBound wrote: Yes, that would be better. welcome to victim blaming 101. Welcome to rape culture. Yes, they should go to the hospital, yes they should go to the police, no they don't always do that, no it's not so that they can make shit up or lie about it later. It's because they're hurt, and scared, and in shock, it's because they just had an unthinkable violent crime committed against them, they've been violated and it's probably going to scar them for the rest of their lives. they want to crawl into a hole and die, not go be questioned and poked and prodded and examined, making them feel even more violated and exposed. They're especially woried that people won't believe them, and a common feeling post-sexual assault is that it's the victims fault. You really don't see how maybe for the first few days post-attack when it's most crucial to gather evidence and file a report, it's also the most difficult times for the victims to do anything even remotely close to rational and clear-headed? They're busy going over in their head every second of every day what they could have done differently to not get raped. Seriously, teach yourself something about survivors before saying stupid things like "wouldn't it be a good idea to go to the hospital?" Yes, it would be a fantastic idea to get checked out and make sure they stay alive....except many wish they weren't alive after that. They don't want to sit in a hospital bed and have someone tell them they're lucky to be alive, or that they're perfectly fine now that they drugs have passed their systems, when they were just raped. This.
Photographer
Cherrystone
Posts: 37171
Columbus, Ohio, US
ontherocks wrote: ok but if you think you are a drug rape victim shouldn't you zip to the hospital (or have someone zip you if you aren't coherent enough) for drug and rape tests? seems like it's much better to have some evidence so it doesn't become just he-said, she-said. You're thinking with "logic", and some things in life you just cannot apply logic to. If you ever walked a mile in their shoes, you'd know better than to say something like that.
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Mad Hatter Imagery
Posts: 1669
Buffalo, New York, US
KelliOnLineGlamourNude wrote: I wouldn't say he's a better role model then the rest. If any of these allegations are true then he's no role model and there's plenty out there who are and have way more to offer. What are the alternatives? Kim Kardashian's husband, Tracy Morgan who is a walking stereotype (respectfully since I know he's recovering), Steve Harvey who is a game show host largely? I'm a white guy so can't assume a white rolemodel will do but who do young black guys have to look to besides rappers? I know sexual assault is devastating and it might not immediately occur to get checked out and collect evidence, but still waiting decades to push for a lawsuit? Rape is unfortunately very common and as I understand it there are large rooms full of rape kits that are a long way from being tested so it isn't like nobody takes the same to get checked. I just think it is horrible to accuse anyone of such a horrible crime without proof that anything happened. If some people are bought off that is their ethical problem. But no matter ones wealth or power proof is proof and I'm not aware of any.
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KGSF
Posts: 1791
Santa Fe, New Mexico, US
Laura and Jules: thank you.
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D A N I
Posts: 4627
Little Rock, Arkansas, US
Why? Because women like money
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Laura UnBound
Posts: 28745
Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Mad Hatter Imagery wrote: What are the alternatives? Kim Kardashian's husband, Tracy Morgan who is a walking stereotype (respectfully since I know he's recovering), Steve Harvey who is a game show host largely? I'm a white guy so can't assume a white rolemodel will do but who do young black guys have to look to besides rappers? I know sexual assault is devastating and it might not immediately occur to get checked out and collect evidence, but still waiting decades to push for a lawsuit? Rape is unfortunately very common and as I understand it there are large rooms full of rape kits that are a long way from being tested so it isn't like nobody takes the same to get checked. I just think it is horrible to accuse anyone of such a horrible crime without proof that anything happened. If some people are bought off that is their ethical problem. But no matter ones wealth or power proof is proof and I'm not aware of any. Why are we so bent on making pop culture figures role models in the first place? I mean there are plenty good people working in showbiz and I understand that it's so easy to soak up music and TV and movies and sports instead of like...read a book on history...but why on earth are we so insistent that these people be shining beacons of light for us?
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scrymettet
Posts: 33239
Quebec, Quebec, Canada
I still don't get that celeb thing. Blown up stuff beyond my grasp. why lose time over it ? Rape is a violent crime that have to be dealt with in court or with a shotgun. Not on every internet corners.
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Lovely Day Media
Posts: 5885
Vineland, New Jersey, US
Robb Mann wrote: The court of public opinion has already found him guilty. That may be the closest to justice his alleged victims ever get. I don't see anyone 'winning' here. Why do alleged victims need justice? I'm of the opinion that only victims need justice (not that it helps them recover any) and the only way to actually make them victims is to find the alleged perp guilty in a court of law. Waiting 20-30 years to report these things doesn't exactly help do that.
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Lovely Day Media
Posts: 5885
Vineland, New Jersey, US
R80 wrote: I'd hate to believe it was true. As a kid, a buddy and I would rush out and buy his latest comedy record then rush home to listen to it, usually rolling on the floor in laughter as we did. Later, I watched him diligently in "I Spy" with Robert Culp. He built a reputation as being one of the few comedians to never use fowl language and later had that "fatherly image." Heck, I remember reading about him having a shit fit when the hot actress that played his daughter Denise, did a topless scene in a movie. (I'm gettin' old...can't remember her name right now.) I just saw tonight that TVland has canceled all upcoming reruns of his show and whatever he had in the works, movie or whatever, is gone. Lisa Bonet in the movie Angel Heart.
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kickfight
Posts: 35054
Portland, Oregon, US
Mad Hatter Imagery wrote: who do young black guys have to look to besides rappers? Keegan-Michael Key (Key & Peele) Kevin Peele (Key & Peele) Wyatt Cenac (Daily Show, etc) Jaden Smith (Karate Kid remake, etc) Dayo Okeniyi (The Hunger Games) Just off the top of my head... HOWEVER... I strongly recommend NOT making this about Cosby's race and/or making it a "black people" issue. This is about a famous person being accused of rape. Let's keep it about that.
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Good Egg Productions
Posts: 16713
Orlando, Florida, US
Mad Hatter Imagery wrote: who do young black guys have to look to besides rappers? I heard that the president of the united states and the leader of the free world is black. But don't quote me on that. Kickfight is right. This isn't about race. This is about privilege and those with it who think they can do anything they want. And how our society is sick of this practice. Eventually, it'll filter all the way up to our politicians and government, but for now, we're vilifying actors and sports players.
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Jim Ball
Posts: 17632
Frontenac, Kansas, US
Good Egg Productions wrote: I heard that the president of the united states and the leader of the free world is black. But don't quote me on that. Kickfight is right. This isn't about race. This is about privilege and those with it who think they can do anything they want. And how our society is sick of this practice. Eventually, it'll filter all the way up to our politicians and government, but for now, we're vilifying actors and sports players. Did the concept of "innocent until proven guilty" go out the window because he is a celebrity? From what I've seen so far, the accusers come across, imho, as a bunch of money-grubbers.
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Mad Hatter Imagery
Posts: 1669
Buffalo, New York, US
Laura UnBound wrote: Why are we so bent on making pop culture figures role models in the first place? I mean there are plenty good people working in showbiz and I understand that it's so easy to soak up music and TV and movies and sports instead of like...read a book on history...but why on earth are we so insistent that these people be shining beacons of light for us? I agree they shouldn't be. Ideally our politicians should be worth looking up to but clearly they aren't up for the task. The pope has said and done some promising things but I don't think most want to achieve the standards as high as is of the clergy. lol. Who that is know isn't a celebrity of one kind or another?
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Mad Hatter Imagery
Posts: 1669
Buffalo, New York, US
Good Egg Productions wrote: I heard that the president of the united states and the leader of the free world is black. But don't quote me on that. Kickfight is right. This isn't about race. This is about privilege and those with it who think they can do anything they want. And how our society is sick of this practice. Eventually, it'll filter all the way up to our politicians and government, but for now, we're vilifying actors and sports players. I don't think people look up to the president as much as in previous generations. And I fear due to racial reasons this president hasn't been as effective as he could have been when working with so many white republicans as he could have had it not been their primary goal to defeat him no what of their ideas he may agree with but I digress. Getting back to celebrity in general there aren't many that inspire people to do better. They just mostly make their millions and push photographers away. lol. Hugh Jackman I hear is pretty awesome though. lol.
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Fotticelli
Posts: 12252
Rockville, Maryland, US
mikell wrote: Soap Box is close and another thread on this subject was locked for going there Let's keep this one open. The word is closed, d at the end. Mr. Soapbox is closed Nazi.
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Fotticelli
Posts: 12252
Rockville, Maryland, US
Mad Hatter Imagery wrote: Why do people keep accusing him of alleged improper behavior 20+ years afterwards? Because that shit doesn't go away with time. I'm not saying that he did it because we don't know until he is proven guilty but, in general, time doesn't make doesn't make terrible things right. If those women were raped I imagine how they would want to speak up before the rapist dies. When you ask question like that I wonder about what all the mercury did to your brain.
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