Francisco Castro wrote:
I am really getting tired of all the paperwork and hassle it takes just to go to a beach and shoot! It's crazy! Permits, licenses, fees, required paid security, etc. etc. etc.

So, best beach location on the continental US (lower 48), where you can just go, do you thing, not bother anyone, and not be bothered by "the man"?

what beach do you shoot at? I've never had a problem in NJ or De.

Michael Alestra wrote:

what beach do you shoot at? I've never had a problem in NJ or De.

I'm in the middle of the country (landlocked in Cincinnati) so when I want a beach shot, I have to travel. At this stage, going to the Atlantic is just slightly less inconvenient than going to the Pacific, and about the same to the gulf. I would gladly trade travel time for a no hassle experience.

Francisco Castro wrote:

I'm in the middle of the country (landlocked in Cincinnati) so when I want a beach shot, I have to travel. At this stage, going to the Atlantic is just slightly less inconvenient than going to the Pacific, and about the same to the gulf. I would gladly trade travel time for a no hassle experience.

Could you just drive to the lake?  It could save you some money and I've done a bunch of shoots at beaches along lake Ontario and they worked out pretty well.  They're certainly not as nice as ones in the Caribbean obviously but it might be a good option B.

Laura Bello wrote:

Could you just drive to the lake?  It could save you some money and I've done a bunch of shoots at beaches along lake Ontario and they worked out pretty well.  They're certainly not as nice as ones in the Caribbean obviously but it might be a good option B.

I went up to the great lakes and the color of the water was just horrible. You could tell it was brownish, even when the sky was blue (hoping for the color of the sky to reflect on the water). The sand also didn't look right. I wouldn't mind a lake, if it was clean and clear.

Francisco Castro wrote:

I went up to the great lakes and the color of the water was just horrible. You could tell it was brownish, even when the sky was blue (hoping for the color of the sky to reflect on the water). The sand also didn't look right. I wouldn't mind a lake, if it was clean and clear.

Where did you go?

Francisco Castro wrote:
I am really getting tired of all the paperwork and hassle it takes just to go to a beach and shoot! It's crazy! Permits, licenses, fees, required paid security, etc. etc. etc.

So, best beach location on the continental US (lower 48), where you can just go, do you thing, not bother anyone, and not be bothered by "the man"?

Since you are in OH, flying down to a nice beach in Florida will be the same cost as flying to Bahamas.  We will have our sailboat in Bahamas in late October.  You can charter our boat with a Captain.  You will have your private beach and Cay stay for a week, or sail to different island as you wish. 

More conchs and lobsters than humans. 

Francisco Castro wrote:
I went up to the great lakes and the color of the water was just horrible. You could tell it was brownish, even when the sky was blue (hoping for the color of the sky to reflect on the water). The sand also didn't look right. I wouldn't mind a lake, if it was clean and clear.

I guess I can see that, the beaches here certainly don't look like the ones in VS swim ads but really unless I'm getting paid as much as their team is it just seems like a bit of a waste to spend all that money to go to a nicer beach, I think you can still get decent shots if you find the right place along the lake.  I guess if you have money to spare though why not.

GRMACK wrote:
Now that I've thought about it, some beaches where the hotels are up against it have less "The Man" interactions, permits, insurance, etc.

Some around South Lake Tahoe we had zero problems with as long we stayed the night.  Some have boat docks, rentals, etc.  Very blue water too.

Seems the cities and counties with beach patrols, lifeguards, and the ones with nearby "film permit agencies or commissions" are the worst (i.e. LA films in Los Angeles who controls a lot of permitting, insurance checks, etc.).  Private beaches with the hotels may be the best bet.

I have never been to Tahoe. Might be a good idea to go at least once.

L.A. was a very bad experience. Each city wanted their own permit, in addition to the county. If you used a park, Parks and Recreation had to get involved too. Beaches, streets, mountains, parks... everywhere you went, paperwork had to be files and cops are quick to question anyone with anything larger than a point and shoot camera.

I like New York City's policy of, "as long as you're not exercising exclusive use of a public area or using public resources, you can shoot without a need for a permit".  That is ideal, really.

Francisco Castro wrote:
I like New York City's policy of, "as long as you're not exercising exclusive use of a public area or using public resources, you can shoot without a need for a permit".  That is ideal, really.

Sorry to bust your bubble but that does not apply to beaches which are under Parks Dept rules that are more restrictive
(I was chased off Coney Island by Parks Dept police for not having permit)

Brooklyn Bridge Images wrote:

Sorry to bust your bubble but that does not apply to beaches which are under Parks Dept rules that are more restrictive
(I was chased off Coney Island by Parks Dept police for not having permit)

A model posing nude there got a ticket.

Brooklyn Bridge Images wrote:
Sorry to bust your bubble but that does not apply to beaches which are under Parks Dept rules that are more restrictive
(I was chased off Coney Island by Parks Dept police for not having permit)

I don't know about Coney Island (is that still in NYC, or is that considered outside of the city?), but here is a link to the  NYC website talking about permits.

http://www.nyc.gov/html/film/html/permi … _fee.shtml

It says, "Permits are not be required for casual photographers, tourists, credentialed members of the media or other members of the public who do not use vehicles or equipment or assert exclusive use of City property. Standing on a street, walkway of a bridge, sidewalk or other pedestrian passageway while using a hand-held device and not otherwise asserting exclusive use of City property is not an activity that requires a permit.".

They also provide a downloadable "official permit" with the rules that you can show any official if you are questioned.

I understand this post was about beaches, but when I mentioned NYC policy, I was talking about about NYC, not necessarily the beaches of NY. If the city policy applied to beaches around the country, it would be great.

Francisco Castro wrote:
I don't know about Coney Island (is that still in NYC, or is that considered outside of the city?), but here is a link to the  NYC website talking about permits.

http://www.nyc.gov/html/film/html/permi … _fee.shtml

It says, "Permits are not be required for casual photographers, tourists, credentialed members of the media or other members of the public who do not use vehicles or equipment or assert exclusive use of City property. Standing on a street, walkway of a bridge, sidewalk or other pedestrian passageway while using a hand-held device and not otherwise asserting exclusive use of City property is not an activity that requires a permit.".

They also provide a downloadable "official permit" with the rules that you can show any official if you are questioned.

I understand this post was about beaches, but when I mentioned NYC policy, I was talking about about NYC, not necessarily the beaches of NY. If the city policy applied to beaches around the country, it would be great.

Yes, Coney is in NYC
Beaches are run by Parks Department, not same policy City property. I pretty sure that is mentioned somewhere on that site if not on that page. Same would apply to Central Park and other parks. Coney used to be much more lax. Depending on time of year, day of the week, time of day you might get by with 'nothing touching the ground' light production but Coney has been crowded this summer. I have shot there many times, but generally avoid the middle of the summer.

Ft. Tilden would be a better shot but after Labor Day. I would not consider either 'best beach in US' by a long shot.

Someone mentioned Sandy Hook. It's much more of a beach than the NYC beaches, but I have heard of strict enforcement of regulations between Memorial Day and Labor Day.

Connor Photography wrote:
Since you are in OH, flying down to a nice beach in Florida will be the same cost as flying to Bahamas.  We will have our sailboat in Bahamas in late October.  You can charter our boat with a Captain.  You will have your private beach and Cay stay for a week, or sail to different island as you wish. 

More conchs and lobsters than humans. 

Exuma?

RBD

R Bruce Duncan wrote:

Exuma?

RBD

Our favorite port is Marsh Harbor, countless Cays and uninhibited island.  You can call yourself a king or queen for a month or so without any problems.  We can work way down to Turks and Caicos even to DR. We just need to stay away from the cruise ships.  When we run out supplies (beer), we sail across the gulf stream to Lake Worth, FL and restock our supplies again. The cruisers band together so we can have endless supply of U.S. goods and food.   We only need to buy water and fresh veggies.  We can trade our beer with the locals for lobsters and fish if you don't have your luck.  A very simple life indeed.  LOL.

Francisco Castro wrote:
I am really getting tired of all the paperwork and hassle it takes just to go to a beach and shoot! It's crazy! Permits, licenses, fees, required paid security, etc. etc. etc.

So, best beach location on the continental US (lower 48), where you can just go, do you thing, not bother anyone, and not be bothered by "the man"?

Just curious: What is your setup? Are we talking just you and a model? Or do you bring a full production crew (assistants, makeup/hair, stylists, etc) including lights, scrims, reflectors, props, etc?

If you are bringing a full crew, it sounds like you might have the budget to shoot on a private beach for whatever they charge you to rent it for the day. Then there is no one to hassle you (except maybe the property owner).

Francisco Castro wrote:
I am really getting tired of all the paperwork and hassle it takes just to go to a beach and shoot! It's crazy! Permits, licenses, fees, required paid security, etc. etc. etc.

So, best beach location on the continental US (lower 48), where you can just go, do you thing, not bother anyone, and not be bothered by "the man"?

Look at  ---
    Michigan City and area.
              http://michigancityparks.com/

Indiana Dunes State Park
http://www.in.gov/dnr/parklake/2980.htm



also Google -->    indiana dunes national lakeshore         
            (permit needed in NPS areas for anything that looks commercial)

http://www.nps.gov/indu/learn/photosmul … flickr.htm
https://www.flickr.com/photos/indianadu … 899275473/

http://www.nwitimes.com/news/local/port … dc332.html

John Fisher wrote:
I do get sick of only sand and water,but then one of the amazing people I have had the opportunity to work with shows up, and I'm thrilled silly that I am in South Beach. That said, I will be paddling a surf board to Cuba as soon as we can go!

John

Thank you very much!! Sounds like my next trip is to South Beach!

Steinberg Photo wrote:
Just curious: What is your setup? Are we talking just you and a model? Or do you bring a full production crew (assistants, makeup/hair, stylists, etc) including lights, scrims, reflectors, props, etc?

If you are bringing a full crew, it sounds like you might have the budget to shoot on a private beach for whatever they charge you to rent it for the day. Then there is no one to hassle you (except maybe the property owner).

My setup will be what it needs to be. It could be just me, the camera, and the model. It could be more with the MUA and an assistant to help with the lighting.

Taking photos with a model who is an adult is not an illegal act. It's not even remotely dangerous, posing no threat to anyone. Why should we have to skulk around like drug dealers trying to peddle crack? We are not taking anything away from the beach other than images. The sun will set whether or not someone is there to photograph it; just as the waves will crash on the rocks regardless of the presence of a model. Unless we litter, there is ZERO impact on the environment. Thousands of people go to the beach to enjoy the outdoors. Why should 5 people be barred just because they are there to lend their skills to take a great photograph?

Steinberg Photo wrote:
Just curious: What is your setup? Are we talking just you and a model? Or do you bring a full production crew (assistants, makeup/hair, stylists, etc) including lights, scrims, reflectors, props, etc?

If you are bringing a full crew, it sounds like you might have the budget to shoot on a private beach for whatever they charge you to rent it for the day. Then there is no one to hassle you (except maybe the property owner).

Francisco Castro wrote:
My setup will be what it needs to be. It could be just me, the camera, and the model. It could be more with the MUA and an assistant to help with the lighting.

You never did answer the question. Doing so might illuminate the rest of us in why you're having such a difficulty using the locations you're needing. If we knew said setup, we might be able to point out a countermeasure that would attract less attention from the authorities in question.

Francisco Castro wrote:
Taking photos with a model who is an adult is not an illegal act. It's not even remotely dangerous, posing no threat to anyone. Why should we have to skulk around like drug dealers trying to peddle crack? We are not taking anything away from the beach other than images. The sun will set whether or not someone is there to photograph it; just as the waves will crash on the rocks regardless of the presence of a model. Unless we litter, there is ZERO impact on the environment. Thousands of people go to the beach to enjoy the outdoors. Why should 5 people be barred just because they are there to lend their skills to take a great photograph?

You're absolutely right that the scene will be there regardless. However the applicable people don't know why YOU are there, nor would they know what kind of impact you're going to have, nor what kind of money you're making off of using the site.

You might be a good, responsible citizen but other people are not. From where they're coming from, I think that's probably the worry.

Farenell Photography wrote:
You never did answer the question. Doing so might illuminate the rest of us in why you're having such a difficulty using the locations you're needing. If we knew said setup, we might be able to point out a countermeasure that would attract less attention from the authorities in question.

I did answer it. The crew I will have will depend on the job I need to do. I'm not going to say it's only going to be me and a model, when there might be other people there on some projects. But then, there might be a project when it is exactly that; just me and the model with no extra gear beyond that of a camera and a speedlight. It will be what it needs to be, no more, no less.

BTW-- I was in Los Angeles, just me and 1 model. We were walking (not shooting yet), camera was around my neck, when the beach patrol asked me if I had a permit for photography. No extra people, no tripods, reflectors, or light stands. Just the camera was enough for them to ask me for a permit.

Farenell Photography wrote:
You're absolutely right that the scene will be there regardless. However the applicable people don't know why YOU are there, nor would they know what kind of impact you're going to have, nor what kind of money you're making off of using the site.

I would think that the presence of a camera, a person posing in front of a camera, and maybe a light or two would let anyone know why we are there. When people are laying on the beach, do people wonder what they're doing? How about those guys playing frisbee? Doesn't the frisbee give a clue as to what they're doing? Do they need permits for the frisbee just in case in gets away from them and hits/hurts someone? That sounds more dangerous than me taking a photo.

Now, you mention money; they do not know what kind of money I am making. What does it matter how much money I make taking photos on a public beach? I am not using any resources that they pay for. There is no more cost to them than if we were other people who went out to the beach for a picnic.

Francisco Castro wrote:

I did answer it. The crew I will have will depend on the job I need to do. I'm not going to say it's only going to be me and a model, when there might be other people there on some projects. But then, there might be a project when it is exactly that; just me and the model with no extra gear beyond that of a camera and a speedlight. It will be what it needs to be, no more, no less.

BTW-- I was in Los Angeles, just me and 1 model. We were walking (not shooting yet), camera was around my neck, when the beach patrol asked me if I had a permit for photography. No extra people, no tripods, reflectors, or light stands. Just the camera was enough for them to ask me for a permit.


I would think that the presence of a camera, a person posing in front of a camera, and maybe a light or two would let anyone know why we are there. When people are laying on the beach, do people wonder what they're doing? How about those guys playing frisbee? Doesn't the frisbee give a clue as to what they're doing? Do they need permits for the frisbee just in case in gets away from them and hits/hurts someone? That sounds more dangerous than me taking a photo.

Now, you mention money; they do not know what kind of money I am making. What does it matter how much money I make taking photos on a public beach? I am not using any resources that they pay for. There is no more cost to them than if we were other people who went out to the beach for a picnic.

LA STARSHOOTER WROTE: Los Angeles is tough and it must be very tough for visitors trying to work with a model on a beach. The desert is also expensive--that is the places that are where everyone wants to have a great backdrop. You also have to put them on your insurance. That said I really haven' run afoul when I've wanted to do something with reflectors and lights, except for one area downtown, a bridge where on Sunday you're allowed to shoot without a permit. There are so many entities and one or two will go beyond their area of responsibility.

Connor Photography wrote:
Sandy Hook, NJ and Assateague National Seashore in MD/VA are easy access.  Unless you are bring in whole production team, no park rangers will bother you.  In fact you wont see anyone there in the weekday.  Besides, Assateague has plenty of ponies to boot.

+1

I have never had a problem at Sandy Hook.  It has been a while since I have been to Assateague, but the beach is miles long and you can get away from everybody.  Take massive amounts of bug spray.  Horse flies and green heads are ... everywhere.

Sandy Hook has a legal nude beach.  (Alcohol is also legal there.)  Go after Labor Day to avoid the crowds.  There are wildlife protection areas on the beach, which limit where on the beach you can go, but those are loosened after labor day.  The water will not be a warm blue but you can expect blue.  Other advantages include the New York sky line across the bay, the old Coast Guard station with buildings, a lighthouse and weaponry.  There are also some old artillery pieces just off the beach. (No nudity permitted there).  There are several beach areas on Sandy Hook.  Some have really short distances from the parking to the surf.  Others (Gunnison- the nude beach) is a long walk.  The beach is very wide. 

I will qualify that I have never shot with a crew, light stands or other fussy things at Sandy Hook.  Just natural light.  I wouldn't piss the rangers off.  I have seen them arrest naked people.  But they just walked by me while I was shooting.

Sandy Hook is a National Gateway and administered by the Park Service.

I have also shot at the Barnegate Light Park without a problem.

Most Jersey beaches require beach tags (beach tax) if you are on the beach during peak hours and in season.  Stay off the dunes.  Stay away from the worst of the "Sandy" damaged towns.  Tourist seem to be treated as intruders there.

At Sandy Hook and other places, I place my camera gear in a styrofoam cooler when it is not in use.  It protects it and makes me less obvious.  Just me and my daughter out on the beach.

Connor Photography wrote:
Sandy Hook, NJ and Assateague National Seashore in MD/VA are easy access.  Unless you are bring in whole production team, no park rangers will bother you.  In fact you wont see anyone there in the weekday.  Besides, Assateague has plenty of ponies to boot.

Hunter  GWPB wrote:
+1

I have never had a problem at Sandy Hook.  It has been a while since I have been to Assateague, but the beach is miles long and you can get away from everybody.  Take massive amounts of bug spray.  Horse flies and green heads are ... everywhere.

Sandy Hook has a legal nude beach.  (Alcohol is also legal there.)  Go after Labor Day to avoid the crowds.  There are wildlife protection areas on the beach, which limit where on the beach you can go, but those are loosened after labor day.  The water will not be a warm blue but you can expect blue.  Other advantages include the New York sky line across the bay, the old Coast Guard station with buildings, a lighthouse and weaponry.  There are also some old artillery pieces just off the beach. (No nudity permitted there).  There are several beach areas on Sandy Hook.  Some have really short distances from the parking to the surf.  Others (Gunnison- the nude beach) is a long walk.  The beach is very wide. 

I will qualify that I have never shot with a crew, light stands or other fussy things at Sandy Hook.  Just natural light.  I wouldn't piss the rangers off.  I have seen them arrest naked people.  But they just walked by me while I was shooting.

Sandy Hook is a National Gateway and administered by the Park Service.

I have also shot at the Barnegate Light Park without a problem.

Most Jersey beaches require beach tags (beach tax) if you are on the beach during peak hours and in season.  Stay off the dunes.  Stay away from the worst of the "Sandy" damaged towns.  Tourist seem to be treated as intruders there.

At Sandy Hook and other places, I place my camera gear in a styrofoam cooler when it is not in use.  It protects it and makes me less obvious.  Just me and my daughter out on the beach.

Like you, many members here offer lot of good solution for the OP.  But by re-reading the OP's post and his answers, it is evident that OP was not to seek solutions but about his rant to today's society treating photographers.  In reality, I am not sure how much the OP has spent on permits, licenses, fees, required paid security, etc. etc. etc..  Yes, things are a bit difference compared to the old days say before 9/11, but it hardly affects my shooting style in public scene.  If you want to compare to the photographers in UK, they have a lot worse condition than us.   I have never had any problems with any law enforcers.  When I am out to do a shoot, my objective is get the images I am seeking with the model.  I don't care much about my legal rights and who is the boss.  If this really bothers me, I will take it up in a proper channel and certainly not in front of the government employees battling the pissing contest.  There are so many placed to shoot. 

If it needs to be, it only take a few seconds to get the shot I want.  Gorilla shooting style comes handy.   Sensible, focused, less combatant often take home the trophy.  We pick our own poisons, and no body is to blame.  LOL.

Connor Photography wrote:
Like you, many members here offer lot of good solution for the OP.  But by re-reading the OP's post and his answers, it is evident that OP was not to seek solutions but about his rant to today's society treating photographers.  In reality, I am not sure how much the OP has spent on permits, licenses, fees, required paid security, etc. etc. etc..

Actually if you read one of my responses, I thanked a person who suggested South Beach in Miami, and have started making plans to shoot there. I really was looking for advice, and yes, I have spent a decent amount of money and effort securing all the requirements made by different locations and jurisdictions.

So, yes, I was seeking a solution, and even though there was some frustration evident in my posts, it wasn't because I haven't had any experience with the requirements. It is BECAUSE I have experienced the frustration of having to deal with officious bureaucratic nonsense.