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Problem with an escort?
Hello! I was in the middle of arranging what sounded like,a fantastic shoot. The photographer sounded great as did the theme. However,when I mentioned I would have an escort,he said he didnt like escorts and would have to take a raincheck until I change the way I shoot. I was really shocked. Im pretty new to MM and thought it was common sense to take somebody to shoots with photographers I have never met. So what is the deal with escorts? Leone P. X Dec 31 12 02:47 am Link Escorts can distract models and photographers. There is also a fear that they might steal equipment. They can also be a big help and make good lookouts. Its for each model and photographer to work out their approach to escorts. Your nearly photographer obviously has worked out his. Dec 31 12 03:00 am Link Natural Means wrote: They can also cancel, which adds another point of failure to the shoot. Dec 31 12 03:08 am Link My escort would be simply there for my safety so would just sit in the corner and watch. Leone P. X Dec 31 12 03:10 am Link My escort would never do that to me as I would have made sure they are available first. They also love with me so they would need a realy good excuse haha. Leone P. X Dec 31 12 03:12 am Link Leone P wrote: first you need to understand that many photographers, myself included, do not allow escorts for several reasons. Dec 31 12 03:20 am Link I guess i'm just shocked. If I went to a shoot alone and something horrible did happen, how would my family feel. I would be chastised for not taking an escort and they would blame themselves for not insisting they come with me. I have a husband and children to consider. My safety and peace of mind should surely be considered. Leone P. X Dec 31 12 03:24 am Link I don't mind escorts under certain circumstances. Boyfriends, husbands, fathers or brothers are out at all times. Why? All will interfere if they think the pose is too sexy and for other reasons. You may not think it will happen but it's a 99% certainty. In the case of boyfriends, especially new ones, the model usually feels that she has to include him in the conversation. If she's chatting to him she's not paying attention to what I'm paying her for and the flow of work will be affected, along with the quality of the poses. Mothers often try and take over the shoot and sometimes want sexier poses than I'm looking for. I recently had the experience of having to ask a mother to leave the studio. I was shooting portfolio shots for a 16 year old, over my shoulder her mother gave orders like, pull your skirt up more, open another button, etc. Girl friends are ok, as long as they understand that they are there to observe, don't talk to the model or comment on poses. If she's on the phone talking loudly, it's also a probelm. She should remain behind the photographer, so as not to interfer with the shot. She should remain in studio and not go through anything that's not her's. I work from a professional, stand alone studio, all my equipment is in view. Everything in my office is locked away. Some photographers work in temporary studios, set up in their homes and cann't secure their property as easily. Many have had items taken. Sometimes these are very valuable but sometimes they are not and seem to be taken just for the sake of it. Not many escorts will go along with the restrictions placed on them and few photographers will take the risk of a shoot being ruined, wasting time and money and there's also the risk of theft. I have an assistant who can keep an eye on the escort, not all photographers have one. Remember, you may trust your escort 100% but the photographer knows nothing about this person and has no way of checking and you're asking him/her to do what you're not willing to do. Worse still, if the escort is a problem, the photographer has no proof of who he is or where he comes from, only your word, the word of a stranger. You on the other hand will have a lot of details on the photographer, including at least his business address and mm profile. I hope that fully explains why many photographers will not work with a model who brings an escort. If you don't know the photographers, check with models that he has worked with before, get their opinion and decide what to do then. Tell someone where you're going, what time you'll be back and give them the photographer's name and any contact details you have, phone number, address, etc. Send a text to some one when you get to the studio and again when you leave. If you feel at risk at any time, finish the shoot and leave. Dec 31 12 03:26 am Link It's possible your photographer has previously had bad experiences. It's easy to say that your escort will just sit in the corner, but during the shoot he could get tired sitting and want to walk around a little or use the bathroom - your photographer might not comfortable having a stranger walking about with lots of expensive equipment lying around. Also you can say he is just there for your safety, but how is the photographer to know that the escort won't be a distraction for you? That you won't lose focus because you are worried that your escort is bored after sitting in the corner for an hour? Personally i don't have a problem with escorts, but i can understand why other people would refuse to work with them. Dec 31 12 03:31 am Link Trust is a two way street. If the photographer doesn't have an assistant, he or she may have to be alone with you and your escort (who he or she may not be paying attention to - or not want to pay attention to while shooting you). A lot has been written on this subject in the forums. You can do a search and turn up a lot more explanation about all sides of this issue. Dec 31 12 03:36 am Link Leone P wrote: this is where you need to pull your big girl panties up and decide whether modeling is for you or not. Like I said before, I've yet to see when an escort was "needed" on set. If you're concerned about your safety with any particular photographer- DON'T SHOOT WITH HIM/HER. If not, then treat this as any other job. Be professional, show up on time. Do a good job. Get paid. Leave...and possibly get other paying work/referrals. Dec 31 12 03:40 am Link Well you have certainly given me alot to think about. Thankyou everyone. P.s- The shoot was TF. Dec 31 12 03:44 am Link An escort who just sits in the corner and watches. At best, the model will keep glancing across for approval..ruining a load of shots with glances in the wrong direction, whilst the phorographer gets more irritated by some lump in the corner. At worst..they try and 'help' by directing the model..then things really work out nicely..not! Check the photographer's credits, check out their work, check with the models they have worked with. Protect your safety that way. Let your family know where you'll be. But if you want to work with a specific photographer, then at least respect their work ethic! Dec 31 12 03:54 am Link I've worked with models that have brought 'escorts'. I've always turned the escorts in to assistant. On the whole I'd rather work with an 'assistant' but it's impossible to guarantee the escort will suddenly turn in to a perfect assistant. OP - here are a few of the things that can go wrong, in chronological order, with an escort being 'involved' in a shoot: 1. On the day of the shoot he/she can't be bothered to go. So you don't go. Shoot is cancelled. 2. On arrival the escort and photographer don't hit it off (for all kind of reasons). So the shoot ends there. 3. The escort stays at the shoot location and; a) gets bored and taps his watch at the model meaning lets get going. Shoot ends early. b) escort distracts the model. c) model is self-conscious in front of the escort. d) escort gets bored and starts wandering around the studio/home/location. 4. The escort starts laying down the law as to how the model should be posed. 5. Escort demands all the raw files from the shoot on CD before leaving - or some similar scenario. These are the more benign scenarios. I'm sure some photographers have experienced worse ones. OP - it's not personal, it's just that most photographers prefer to work with a model that doesn't bring an escort. It's that simple. Good luck. Dec 31 12 04:15 am Link Leone P wrote: Which does not matter in the least. Dec 31 12 04:20 am Link Why is working with a photographer dangerous? Dec 31 12 04:34 am Link Leone P wrote: My escort would never cancel. Dec 31 12 04:39 am Link Escorts can be a pain. As mentioned by everyone else the escort can effect the shoot and can be very annoying. I have had some good ones but more often they are a pain. So, the good one, well he was her boyfriend (always dodgy) but as it was a nude shoot there wasn't much of a problem with her asking permission to remove clothes etc. but he made himself useful holding her clothes (location shoot). I did have one model who seemed to look for permission from her bf before every pose (although I got an email a few months later saying "dumped bf, will now do nude"). The perfect escort should just sit there quietly. Ideally they should be in an anti-room of the studio if there is one - i.e. within ear shot if you scream. I understand why you might want one but you also have to understand that asking to bring one is a bit of an insult to the photographer as you are questioning his professionalism. One way around it could be to think of another reason why you want to bring someone. If you need them to drive you, you need help carrying all your outfits etc. Just don't make it sound like 'I need an escort 'cos I think you might be a pervert'. Dec 31 12 04:42 am Link BurningImageIreland wrote: yep. I use to be pro-escort , always saying that new models needed them. But you know what? It only takes one bad escort to turn a photographer against them. Dec 31 12 04:42 am Link 
Photographer Posts: 4288 Amundsen-Scott - permanent station of the US, Unclaimed Sector, Antarctica Leone P wrote: No need to start another thread and wait for answers. Go to 'forums' and click on 'search' and enter the keyword 'escort.' You'll find 1,479,052 threads (well, 1,479,053 now...) on the subject. Dec 31 12 04:50 am Link The only time another person is allowed to accompany a model to my studio now is if they're the driver or if the model is under-18 (I shoot a lot of 'senior' portraits as they're known in the US). I've tried it both ways and finally came to the conclusion that escorts are 'drama' - as others have mentioned: they can be a distraction; they may keep 'souvenirs', they may be unavailable on the day meaning the model cannot attend. Family members are the worst, boyfriends a close second. Even if they jkeep quiet, you can feel thier eyes boring into the back of your head and it makes me uncomfortable. If a model even once mentions 'her safety' in this context while we're setting up the shoot, I call it off as she obviously has the wrong idea about modelling. It's offensive to be classed as a potential rapist or mugger and if the model is going into a shoot with that mindset, it bodes ill for our working relationship. Outside of MM and other web-based meeting places, Models attend commercial and test-shoots with 'strangers' all the time - all the models in my port were unknown to me until we worked together. Some returned for repeat bookings. None were killed, assaulted, groped, leered-at, covertly recorded while changing clothes, robbed or kept in the basement and forced to rub 'lotion' onto themselves. Dec 31 12 04:54 am Link If you're going to insist on an escort, make sure you state it up front so you don't waste the time of people like me who don't allow them Dec 31 12 05:09 am Link I am really sorry if i have caused offence to anyone with this post. All the shoots i have previously done have been with somebody i know,not the photographers so much but they are shoots in which a friend of mine (the MUA used in most of my shoots) has arranged the photographer etc and knows of them from other shoots. This would have been my first shoot with somebody i didn't know and being alone. I guess it was rather daunting. Especially given that i had been told that i should always take an escort with me. The escort was going to be a friend of mine that also does some modeling. I can totally understand what everyone has said and it seems i need to buck up and do my research to ensure my safety. I do not in anyway,expect every photographer to be a creep etc. However,having said that,there is creeps out there and there is far too many horror stories about models being attacked or groped etc. I will have to re-think my escort idea and take a chance. Thankyou all for your replies. Dec 31 12 05:16 am Link Yep. Check my profile. Escorts: No. Been there, done that. Exceptions are the travelling models. Check references. Be smart. See also, http://madamebink.co.uk/?p=450 Don't "take chances". Be smart, learn how to check references, ask around, and let someone know exactly when and where you'll be going before you go. Dec 31 12 05:22 am Link Thankyou,i plan to leave details with my family. I wouldn't be allowed out of the door otherwise  . I plan to do my research and take the plunge. I shouldn't need my hand holding after all,i am a grown woman. Thankyou very much everyone for your help! Dec 31 12 05:28 am Link I recently changed my  /driver criteria. I now allow them if they are fully registered with the SIA (Security Industry Association) and carry their own liability insurance. Before the shoot I require the registration number so I can check them out. This policy was brought in after an incident when equipment was accidentally damaged on location by an and my insurance refused to pay out as the was not part of the paid team. I also agree with the statements here, if you feel you require an for your protection/safety there is a high possibility that you should not be shooting with that particular photographer.Dec 31 12 05:30 am Link It really wasn't that particular photographer. I was under the impression that all models were supposed to take llama herders along on shoots that were with photographers unknown to them. I now understand that this isn't always the case. Dec 31 12 05:34 am Link Never assume anything. Do your reference checks, read the profile pages of the photographers you're in contact with, understand the issues you will have by dictating there will be an escort without asking. Put a note on your profile page in bold you will be bringing an escort with you. All of the above will be lesser of a problem when it is clear on all sides even before any communication starts. I have had friends come or escorts if you like for various reasons. At least you said it before the shoot, for me they usually show up. That is when it can be a bit embarrassing! Dec 31 12 05:39 am Link Leone P wrote: Welcome to the mayhem... Dec 31 12 05:40 am Link for my shoots, any models that wants to brings an llama herder MUST mention this PRIOR to the shoot including their llama herder's name. The llama herder need provide the ID and stay in designated area which is also recorded. Any interference including smoke or washroom break the shoot will stop and wait until return. Anyone showing unannounced will be turned away or shoot cancelled. Dec 31 12 05:45 am Link Leone P wrote: Escorts are an insult, a liability, a waste of space, disturb the shoot, cause cancellations, get in the way, break stuff, steal stuff, attack or threaten photographers... Dec 31 12 05:46 am Link Leone P wrote: Hello, Dec 31 12 05:50 am Link Leone P wrote: The photographer has never met you nor your escort. Dec 31 12 05:56 am Link Again, i apologise if i have offended anyone! Your right, im not very experienced. As I said before,all previous shoots have included somebody in the industry that I know. I hadn't really considered how the photographer may feel to me bringing somebody whom they didn't know. Again, for that, i am genuinely sorry. Dec 31 12 06:00 am Link Leone P wrote: find a qualified mua approved by the photographer. that should never be an interference as they understand the process. Dec 31 12 06:15 am Link Leone P wrote: I don't think anybody will be offended by your asking about bringing an escort in the Modelling Forum - that's kind of what this place is for (and we're certainly used to it!). Dec 31 12 06:15 am Link The 'escort' is a friend of mine who also models. She would have driven me to the shoot and been an observer but i now understand why photographers would take offence at the suggestion of an escort. Dec 31 12 06:18 am Link So just to play devil's advocate, it's you and the photographer, so you bring your escort 'for your protection.' So the photographer brings someone for his protection. Eventually you have way more people involved in a shoot than are actually needed for a shoot. "For your own protection" implies that the photographer is dangerous. If you work at McDonald's do you bring an escort to work with you? As a photographer, I can check up on you. Just as you should do to me. But how can I check up on your escort? All I have is your word that he's a nice guy and will stay out of the way. How do I know he's not a convicted felon who likes to beat up photographers who have expensive equipment? You want someone to provide protection for you but how would you feel if a photographer brought a carrying body guard who is there to protect him from you and your escort? If you won't take an escort to your real job, do your research and act the same way with a photographer. Trust is a big deal. Not every photographer is out to get you. So just want awesome images. Dec 31 12 06:19 am Link Leone P wrote: Bringing an "escort" is a loaded term & conjures up a certain type of person you'll be bringing. As well as an idea in their heads that their job is to protect you instead of making the shoot successful. Dec 31 12 06:29 am Link Leone P wrote: Statistically speaking, you're 4x more like to have "something horrible happen" w/ someone you know than w/ a complete stranger. Dec 31 12 06:30 am Link |
Mine either.
