Call Me Caitlin wrote:
Last week there was this photographer who wanted to work with me, and after learning that I'm half Asian half white, he wanted to make me look even more Asian, a "FOB" or "fresh off the boat".

Obviously, I'm not working with said photographer, but has anyone encountered anything similar?

How can that be racist if he wants to achieve a certain ethnic look?

Call Me Caitlin wrote:
Last week there was this photographer who wanted to work with me, and after learning that I'm half Asian half white, he wanted to make me look even more Asian, a "FOB" or "fresh off the boat".

Obviously, I'm not working with said photographer, but has anyone encountered anything similar?

Not sure if I would consider that racist.   But makes me wonder why the photographer just wouldn't ask someone who's 100% Asian instead?

Call Me Caitlin wrote:
a FOB is considered a racist term, though.

By who?

Images by MR wrote:
Not sure if I would consider that racist.   But makes me wonder why the photographer just wouldn't ask someone who's 100% Asian instead?

Because Caitlin is hot!

Chuckarelei wrote:

How can that be racist if he wants to achieve a certain ethnic look?

I live in the SF Bay Area, there's plenty of other Asian models here...

I just thought it was pretty rude to use that term.

Images by MR wrote:

By who?

I guess a FOB isn't considered racist. Nor is gook, chink, jap or oriental.

They're just words to describe people, right?

Call Me Caitlin wrote:
...learning that I'm half Asian half white, he wanted to make me look even more Asian, a "FOB" or "fresh off the boat"...

Calling you a "gook" is racist, asking for a specific look is not.
This industry is not suitable for little miss sensitive's, you did the photographer a favour by not accepting the invitation.

Call Me Caitlin wrote:
I live in the SF Bay Area, there's plenty of other Asian models here...
I just thought it was pretty rude to use that term.

Then how would you suggest photo/film makers cast for FOB faces/looks? There have been movies/photos about/with people who are FOB looking.

Call Me Caitlin wrote:
I live in the SF Bay Area, there's plenty of other Asian llamas here...

I just thought it was pretty rude to use that term.

Did you communicate to the photographer that you felt it was rude for him to use that term?

There is always the possibility that he didn't realize that it is considered racist.

KM

Call Me Caitlin wrote:

I guess a FOB isn't considered racist. Nor is gook, chink, jap or oriental.

They're just words to describe people, right?

He didn't use those words... he used words that describe a look.

In most cases if the guy was racist it means he is prejudiced AGAINST that race, in which case he wouldn't want to work with or be around them.... he WANTS to work with you.

My opinion, for what it's worth, is that you are being too sensitive.

Glenn Hall - Fine Art wrote:

Calling you a "gook" is racist, asking for a specific look is not.
This industry is not suitable for little miss sensitive's, you did the photographer a favour by not accepting the invitation.

+1

Chuckarelei wrote:

Then how would you suggest photo/film makers cast for FOB faces/looks? There have been movies/photos about/with people who are FOB looking.

Simply cast for Asian people?

Call Me Caitlin wrote:
I guess a FOB isn't considered racist. Nor is gook, chink, jap or oriental.

They're just words to describe people, right?

K E E L I N G wrote:
He didn't use those words... he used words that describe a look.

In most cases if the guy was racist it means he is prejudiced AGAINST that race, in which case he wouldn't want to work with or be around them.... he WANTS to work with you.

My opinion, for what it's worth, is that you are being too sensitive.

+1

Call Me Caitlin wrote:
Last week there was this photographer who wanted to work with me, and after learning that I'm half Asian half white, he wanted to make me look even more Asian, a "FOB" or "fresh off the boat".

Obviously, I'm not working with said photographer, but has anyone encountered anything similar?

Personally, I wouldn't call that racist.  To me racism is malicious and intentional.

K E E L I N G wrote:

He didn't use those words... he used words that describe a look.

In most cases if the guy was racist it means he is prejudiced AGAINST that race, in which case he wouldn't want to work with or be around them.... he WANTS to work with you.

My opinion, for what it's worth, is that you are being too sensitive.

This photographer could have used a better term than "fresh off the boat".

Call Me Caitlin wrote:

I guess a FOB isn't considered racist. Nor is gook, chink, jap or oriental.

They're just words to describe people, right?

Wait, no joke, calling someone oriental is racist?

Call Me Caitlin wrote:
a FOB is considered a racist term, though.

My parents are immigrants (as am I, though I've been here for most of my life). I call them "FOB's" all the time jokingly, because they are very, very, very FOB-ish. I never considered it a racist term.

Schlake wrote:

Personally, I wouldn't call that racist.  To me racism is malicious and intentional.

I still thought it was pretty rude... there are other terms or adjectives to use rather then "FOB".

FootNote Fotography wrote:

Wait, no joke, calling someone oriental is racist?

Well, I thought it was considered a racial slur.

I guess it's just a term to describe people now.

Schlake wrote:
Personally, I wouldn't call that racist.  To me racism is malicious and intentional.

I've seen a lot of people claim, and demonstrate racism who would strongly dispute that it applied to them.

As far as why someone would prefer to work with the OP; well, LOOK AT HER.

FootNote Fotography wrote:
Wait, no joke, calling someone oriental is racist?

Call Me Caitlin wrote:
Well, I thought it was considered a racial slur.

I guess it's just a term to describe people now.

I USED to be "just a term to describe people" from a specific area.  Then someone sent out a memo, and it became "racist."  And we're left with the much less specific or useful "Asian."  But, such is life.

I just bounce light off of people anyway.

Chuckarelei wrote:
Then how would you suggest photo/film makers cast for FOB faces/looks? There have been movies/photos about/with people who are FOB looking.

Call Me Caitlin wrote:
Simply cast for Asian people?

The guy on the far right was specifically cast as a fob asian look:





Did anyone ever think that was racist?

Call Me Caitlin wrote:

I guess a FOB isn't considered racist. Nor is gook, chink, jap or oriental.

They're just words to describe people, right?

FOB could apply to any "immigrant" so I don't consider it racist since it's not race specific.

Chuckarelei wrote:

Chuckarelei wrote:
Then how would you suggest photo/film makers cast for FOB faces/looks? There have been movies/photos about/with people who are FOB looking.

The guy on the far right was specifically cast as a fob asian look:




Did anyone ever think that was racist?

Well, I'm sorry for thinking the term "fresh off the boat" or "FOB" was racist.

Image Magik wrote:

FOB could apply to any "immigrant" so I don't consider it racist since it's not race specific.

I've only heard it used to describe people of Asian descent.

Call Me Caitlin wrote:
I guess I just thought that using the term "fresh off the boat" was a little insensitive to me, not to anyone else.

And . . . some photographer is supposed to know what YOU are sensitive about ?

Time to put on your big girl panties and learn to deal with people in a more mature way

Ken Marcus Studios wrote:
If you want to get technical about it . . .

"Oriental" is NOT "Asian"

The Orient is Turkey . . . and Turkey is NOT in Asia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orient

I've been to Turkey.

Technically, majority of Turkey is part of Asia. Anything west of Istanbul is considered to be part of Europe.

Call Me Caitlin wrote:

I've only heard it used to describe people of Asian descent.

Maybe in the area your in but when Irish immigrants came to New York the phrase could of very well been applied to them.
Unless someone is talking down to you or your race I wouldn't take it personal:-)

K E E L I N G wrote:
He didn't use those words... he used words that describe a look.

In most cases if the guy was racist it means he is prejudiced AGAINST that race, in which case he wouldn't want to work with or be around them.... he WANTS to work with you.

My opinion, for what it's worth, is that you are being too sensitive.

Call Me Caitlin wrote:
This photographer could have used a better term than "fresh off the boat".

I'm sure that what the photographer was looking for was "not americanized". I guess that could be considered a "racist" term too. But in this case, I have to agree with Keeling, maybe you are being a little too sensitive.

You have a certain ethnicity, and you have posted that ethnicity on your profile. Why wouldn't you expect photographers to use that ethnicity in their shoots? That's not being racist, that's being smart. I have worked with a few Asian models, and I've never really believed that I was being racist in trying to highlight the ancestry of those models. Most of those ladies actually do still speak to me, LOL.

Ken Marcus Studios wrote:
If you want to get technical about it . . .

"Oriental" is NOT "Asian"

The Orient is Turkey . . . and Turkey is NOT in Asia.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orient

Odd; I could have sworn "the Orient" was China, Japan, and Korea, more or less. 

Looks it up.

2. Oriental Of or designating the biogeographic region that includes Asia south of the Himalaya Mountains and the islands of the Malay Archipelago.

ForeverFotos wrote:

K E E L I N G wrote:
He didn't use those words... he used words that describe a look.

In most cases if the guy was racist it means he is prejudiced AGAINST that race, in which case he wouldn't want to work with or be around them.... he WANTS to work with you.

My opinion, for what it's worth, is that you are being too sensitive.

I'm sure that what the photographer was looking for was "not americanized". I guess that could be considered a "racist" term too. But in this case, I have to agree with Keeling, maybe you are being a little too sensitive.

You have a certain ethnicity, and you have posted that ethnicity on your profile. Why wouldn't you expect photographers to use that ethnicity in their shoots? That's not being racist, that's being smart. I have worked with a few Asian models, and I've never really believed that I was being racist in trying to highlight the ancestry of those models. Most of those ladies actually do still speak to me, LOL.

I guess I don't really want to be portrayed as an Asian or a white person. I'd rather be ... me.

I'm just a lil offended that he used that term, when he could've used different adjectives and terms to describe how he wanted a specific look.

Call Me Caitlin wrote:
I've only heard it used to describe people of Asian descent.

In high school we had intramural teams. there was a team called the FOB Squad (they came up with the name themselves), which consisted of Asians, Mid Eastern and other students. I think it's more of a generation term at this point.
I don't think it's used enough or with any actual hate or dislike to be considered a slur or anything.

but I totally see that using that specific term is a bit off, when there were other ways to expressing what he/she was looking for.