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umm, don't touch me?
hey, just had a shoot. actually. a friend of mine just had a shoot and i was asked to jump in. she ran off shortly thereafter to catch a train. this was lingerie by the way. and i don't mind being told how to pose etc at all. but hands on? hmmm. female photographers i don't mind, and some male photographers i just feel totally comfortable around. this guy was nice, we were talking about movies, his nephews etc. but at one stage he manually pushed my back closer into the wall, moved my legs a bit and pushed down on my butt. >  don't touch my butt! its mine, grr. unless i like you, what do you think? was i being weird, or was he? Sep 06 05 06:25 am Link He was out of line. Sep 06 05 06:37 am Link oh good, i need that. hate to think i was just being a prima donna or something Sep 06 05 06:53 am Link I would totally have been upset too, and its understandable. Being told how to pose is one thing, but being MADE to pose how he sees fit, by him moving you around like an object, is wrong. Sep 06 05 07:02 am Link I'm a male photographer and I try to avoid touching females (models) in any manner at any time. If they deceide to give me a hug after the session, I let them, but I do not body slam them.A touchy photographer should be named and posted or at least inform other models in the area. Sep 06 05 07:06 am Link Alize-Elizabeth wrote: Sometimes... I am sorry to say... a model just doesn't "get it". I had the situation with an inexperienced model where I had to place a foot for her, because she wasn't aware of her body! Sep 06 05 07:10 am Link Touching is bad. A few hints: I tend to work with a female production team (makeup artist, wardrobe stylist, etc). They can help position a model or a garment. I keep a book of editorials and photos that I use to demonstrate a particular pose. And sometimes I may demonstrate it myself. Just my 2 cents... Sep 06 05 07:25 am Link Tharwat wrote: I usually demonstrate it myself... and often get a chuckle out of it... Sep 06 05 07:31 am Link i have NO probs with my hair being adjusted etc...but my behind is a different matter. especially since I was posing quite nicely without the touching (even he agreed there) so it wasn't that I was a stiff twig refusing to move or anything  Sep 06 05 07:50 am Link Jacinta Lee wrote: I am just wondering how to adjust someones butt? Sep 06 05 07:53 am Link Should have bitch slapped the SOB. He was trying to see how far he could go with you before you gave him a "back-off" vibe. Should have added to the agreement "free ass kicking with every inappropriate move". Sep 06 05 07:59 am Link C R Photography wrote: I agree completely. If I see hair out of place and the model has a perfect pose, I'll usually fix it myself, but grabbing a models butt? Completely uncalled for and inappropriate. Sep 06 05 08:02 am Link Tharwat wrote: Not only is it bad... Sep 06 05 08:25 am Link I sometimes have to manually pose my subject. I will not touch them in any kind of sexual way, but I will walk up to them and for example move and arm, rotate their torso, adjust hair, etc. I will also make it perfectly clear to them when I need to reposition them manually. I think it is inappropriate for him to have touched your ass without first telling you he was going to do so, but as long as he was just positioning you and not squeezing your ass like a squishy ball it's nothing to get that incredibly offended over (he probably didn't think of where he was touching you since he wasn't trying to molest you, just position you). A lot of people online are just mislabeling some photographers. It really comes down if it made you uncomfortable you should have said something (there is a good chance he wasn't even thinking about where he was touching you, just positioning you), and if it wasn't in a sexual way then it's really not worth discussing anymore. It all comes down to if you don't want to be touched... Tell the photographer before, during or even after a shoot (if you didn't tell him before) that people touching you makes you uncomfortable. Sep 06 05 08:31 am Link I'm not a touchy feely kind of guy, so I'm generally hands off. On the other hand, I've had models say "move it for me." I've also brushed dirt or sand off a models butt once or twice. It's not something I would ever do without saying "hey, there's stuff on your butt, can I brush it off?" and usually not before asking the model to do it. On the other hand, this is a conscious effort and I have found myself about to start doing such things with models I'm very comfortable with, and of course, stopped and asked. In the middle of the action, especially when you have a good rapport with some one, it can be instinctual to just do it in the interest of perfection and speed. There is not necessarily a creepy or untoward motivation. However, as professionals, we have an obligation to recognize the limits and to be respectful. Without being there, I don't want to judge anyone too harshly. Did you say something at the time and did he have a reply? Sep 06 05 08:34 am Link He was out of line. Your butt you can move yourself. Fixing your hair or posturing you (arms, etc) is one thing. Did you use any of the pictures he shot after Tushgate? Sep 06 05 08:43 am Link Human beings should NEVER touch each other. If a person touches another persons ass, it is sexual harassment in ANY context. We must never have physical contact with anyone. It is NEVER appropriate. It is ALWAYS wrong. There are ALWAYS vile, perverted and disgusting undertones of sexual depravity whenever someone touches someone else. My goodness, don't you people know that human beings are meant to live in hermetically-sealed glass jars? Take him to court! Sue him! Post his name for all to see! Clearly what he did was the equivalent of being a child molesting rapist with leprosy! Burn him at the stake! Long live Shomer Negia! Sep 06 05 08:53 am Link Eric Muss-Barnes wrote: hahaha roflmao Sep 06 05 08:57 am Link I find that the best way of dealing with this situation is to simply ask the model before you start posing if its ok with her or him if you touch them to help move them into place, whether that includes moving a hair or a leg. However it also, I feel, is impairitive for the model to speak up the second they feel uncomfortable..in any case I tend to think um physical butt manipulation is probably a bad thing. yeah.. -Becky www.OntheBenchPhotography.com Sep 06 05 09:17 am Link :Touch: Ooops..... sorrrrrryyyyyyyyy Sep 06 05 09:35 am Link Never touch Erics or allow Erics to touch you. I prefer to be verbally directed, but when manual posing is necessary, I want some warning. Still, I can't imagine how he need to pose your ass. Sep 06 05 10:23 am Link -Some people objectify models -Verbal communication or demonstrate (really can save some air  -But like Theda, ass adjustment seems a little odd, and it's always a good idea to ask before touching I don't care on the set - move the hair, tighten the dress, whatever - but when I'm not on a set I only let my relatives (esp. super adorable nephews who love to snuggle) and my significant other touch me, which creates a problem when I'm in Brazil because they love to do that face kissey thing THREE times! ah, disease! j/k Sep 06 05 11:09 am Link I was going to post here, but I am laughing so hard at the thought of Udo demonstrating a pose that I can't.....be back later, maybe..... Sep 06 05 11:12 am Link Yeah, I got a laugh out of Udo "posing" too. But hey, if it works for him...work it boy! I have a very hands-off approach myself, just because I need a good reputation. To use third person (joking), Ori needs his Public. I even ask a model if I can touch their hair or even clothes before doing it, or tell the MUA about it. As far as I'm concerned, respectfully and politely act like the model has cooties. Sep 06 05 11:36 am Link Jacinta Lee wrote: Take a pill - get over yourself. Sep 06 05 11:37 am Link Reminds me of that episode of Friends where Chandler's boss keeps slapping him on the ass.. Sep 06 05 11:40 am Link I don't know, I wouldn't assume a model would think of me as a personal trainer or a doctor. Then I'd have to wear gloves! I'm no saint, models aren't either, butt don't take matters into your own hands. I'm not a germophobe, but I know a few. Oh, and I like the saying "build a bridge and get over yourself." Sep 06 05 11:46 am Link Before ever manually adjusting a model (including her hair, clothing, body part, anything) I'll try to describe the change I'm looking for, then even demonstrate it, then ask for permission to move it myself before ever touching him/her. I'm all for affectionate behavior and don't mind touching or being touched personally, but a photoshoot is a professional situation and needs to be treated as such...there are too many lines that can be easily crossed otherwise. I've worked with models who reach a level of comfort with me where they'd rather I just move them if they're not getting it, regardless of what kind of touching that means, but I'd never assume that a model is cool with that. Sep 06 05 11:51 am Link John Jebbia wrote: or where joey sends chandler to the guy for altering pants and innapropriately checks the inseam lol Sep 06 05 11:55 am Link amatuer perverts. don't they know?! you have to ask first! Sep 06 05 12:30 pm Link the photographer should always ask first before touching any body part, including hair. I shoot my friend Kelly all the time and she's super comfortable with me and I STILL ask her before I move a piece of hair away from her face. If you need to pose her, ask if it's alright first! Sep 06 05 03:56 pm Link This is just my world. 'May I make an adjustment to..." your hair, shirt, whatever, that doesn't include some body part. No problem there. If adjustment to posture in some way, "Lift your shoulder more. Look this way." Something like that. Or I'll demonstrate what I want. If that doesn't work, then it's, "May I adjust your shoulder," or whatever. (That actually has happened on occasion in order to get the right flexure for the collarbone to stand out.) I'm having a hard time imagining a situation where a photographer NEEDS to personally adjust the model's butt. And without warning, a definite no-no. Out of line. No, we do not need to live in hermetically sealed containers, and yes, touch is often an important part of human communication (just not with me). But that has to be balanced against the other person's needs for privacy and security. I think that if we actually RESPECT those needs in the other person, then achieving that balance is within the realm of our normal common-sense words and actions. Sep 06 05 05:11 pm Link Alize-Elizabeth wrote: This is my pet peeve. I once observed as a man did this to his wife, who was a model, and it made me sick. And he was her husband! I will not be treated like a doll. Sep 06 05 05:21 pm Link Touching as a rule is inappropriate, whether it be male or female. IF permission is asked for and granted, there is no problem. However, many photographers think if it as no big deal, but it is, and it IS unprofessional, no matter how good of a photographer you may think you are. There are a few that have migrated over to MM from OMP that had reps for inappropriate touching of models, and if they haven't kept their perversions in check, I'm hopeful their names will be made public, or be banned from MM permanently for this type of behavior. It sickens me that everything we have to do as a photographer & businessperson gets so quickly sullied by a few wreckless perverts with cameras that "hide" under the ill deserved title "photographer" Models, if it ever happens to you, report it, and please report him to the site, asap!!! Best Regards, Michael/StratMan Sep 06 05 05:39 pm Link I still have trouble posing without being adjusted. I also sometimes have trouble staying still. Models I have worked with have molested me though, but in a good way. Most of the time patting me on the head, rubbing my belly and telling me I am a good boy.  Sep 06 05 05:40 pm Link Another case of something blown out of proportion. I could see if he grabbed and squeezed, followed it up with "you like that, dontcha baby?" All he did was direct you, not severely rape you and leave you naked in a back alley in a seedy part of town. Sep 06 05 05:43 pm Link Sorry MB... He violated her personal space and that's always wrong. Sep 06 05 05:49 pm Link Hydra wrote: Yea because you know, she's mentally, physically and emotionally scarred for life. Has to go to rape counseling sessions, not to mention his sexual assault trial, then the civil suit for 5 million dollars. Sep 06 05 05:56 pm Link Monty T. Dog wrote: I wish more models would do that for me. Sep 06 05 06:04 pm Link ok unless you ask the model if you can "position" her into the correct pose, its wrong. i usually show them what i want if they just aren't hitting it. sometimes it's a bit awkward doing a feminine pose but its petter than touching parts that would offend the model. Sep 06 05 06:09 pm Link |
