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Model
Alyssa Laganosky
Posts: 10
Chicago, Illinois, US


Hey models...and or photographers...this is just a simple question. Now, don't be all sarcastic and troll like or get angry with this question, because I just don't know: Is it too forward to ask a photographer to submit their work to magazines/blogs? In my experience, TFP means TFpicturesforyourfacebookpage. However, I would prefer the P. Which stands for PRINT. Would a photographer get offended if you asked them to submit their photos to magazines? How about if you submitted their work for them? Thanks guys, appreciate the responses!
Feb 09 13 12:24 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
-The Dave-
Posts: 8,626
Las Vegas, Nevada, US


TFWhatever is whatever you agree on it to be.
Feb 09 13 12:44 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
1472
Posts: 1,058
Pembroke Pines, Florida, US


Yeah ask dont just submit although most publications would ask about it
Feb 09 13 12:44 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
-The Dave-
Posts: 8,626
Las Vegas, Nevada, US


1472 wrote:
Yeah ask dont just submit although most publications would ask about it

Wrong. She does not hold copyright so she can NOT authorize someone else's images to be used.

The photographer can submit if he/she wants.

Feb 09 13 12:47 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Mortonovich
Posts: 5,436
San Diego, California, US


Alyssa Sky wrote:
Hey llamas...and or photographers...this is just a simple question. Now, don't be all sarcastic and troll like or get angry with this question, because I just don't know: Is it too forward to ask a photographer to submit their work to magazines/blogs? In my experience, TFP means TFpicturesforyourfacebookpage. However, I would prefer the P. Which stands for PRINT. Would a photographer get offended if you asked them to submit their photos to magazines? How about if you submitted their work for them? Thanks guys, appreciate the responses!

If you want to see yourself published in print, then work with photographers that already submit and actually get printed already. That will NOT be easy! It is so very hard to get printed. The magazines are getting bombarded with stuff daily. The guys getting printed are getting bombarded by llamas, MUAs etc looking to collaborate.

BTW, the "P" in TFP may stand for "print", yes. But it means a print of the photo. NOT a guarantee of an editorial print.

Blogs are a little more realistic. But again, work with guys that already are on that path.

Feb 09 13 12:53 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Camerosity
Posts: 5,300
Saint Louis, Missouri, US


I wouldn't mind at all, as long as it's discussed in advance - and as long as the magazine wants a usage license, not a transfer of copyrights. This would allow time to research the magazine's requirements and preferences. Many of the models I work with are interested in being published.

For example, the publisher of three pinup magazines has grown tired of classic Vargas-style pinups. He only publishes that style if the photos are from photographers who have contributed to his magazines for years and developed their own fan bases among his readers.

It's more useful to have this type of information before the shoot than after submitting the photos.

From my experience most magazines prefer to work with the photographer rather than the model, for both legal and technical reasons. And I think most photographers would prefer to do or oversee the post-processing and handle the submission process.
Feb 09 13 01:03 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
RKD Photographic
Posts: 3,265
Iserlohn, North Rhine-Westphalia, Germany


No.

Submission to magazines/blogs would count in my view as commercial usage - someone is getting money somewhere/somehow from those things and if it's not me then I'm not interested.

If the model wants to use the images I supply to her on her own Blog ("...here's the shoot I did with the Awesome Rob - check me out!!!"), that's fine, but a third-party's? Nope.
Feb 09 13 02:32 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Mark Harris Photography
Posts: 497
Edison, New Jersey, US


Alyssa Sky wrote:
Hey models...and or photographers...this is just a simple question. Now, don't be all sarcastic and troll like or get angry with this question, because I just don't know: Is it too forward to ask a photographer to submit their work to magazines/blogs? In my experience, TFP means TFpicturesforyourfacebookpage. However, I would prefer the P. Which stands for PRINT. Would a photographer get offended if you asked them to submit their photos to magazines? How about if you submitted their work for them? Thanks guys, appreciate the responses!

I had a model do this recently. She wanted to submit images from our shoot and asked if it would be OK. I was fine with it and provided files of the resolution they needed. The magazine properly required that I sign an agreement for publication as the copyright holder. If the photographer says no then you can not go around them.

Feb 09 13 04:19 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
KA Style
Posts: 1,583
Syracuse, New York, US


-The Dave- wrote:

Wrong. She does not hold copyright so she can NOT authorize someone else's images to be used.

Thats what they said..


You can submit yourself, just get permission from the photographer. I have a model that submits our work all the time. As 1472 said most publications will ask for a release.

Feb 09 13 05:36 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
salvatori.
Posts: 3,804
State College, Pennsylvania, US


Alyssa Sky wrote:
Hey models...and or photographers...this is just a simple question. Now, don't be all sarcastic and troll like or get angry with this question, because I just don't know: Is it too forward to ask a photographer to submit their work to magazines/blogs? In my experience, TFP means TFpicturesforyourfacebookpage. However, I would prefer the P. Which stands for PRINT. Would a photographer get offended if you asked them to submit their photos to magazines? How about if you submitted their work for them? Thanks guys, appreciate the responses!

You are not authorized to submit work on behalf of a photographer unless he has given you written authorization to do so.

Your interpretation of 'tf P' (meaning PRINT) is a bit misguided. TFP was the phrase used before the advent of digital imagery and meant that the trade session resulted in the photographer giving you actual prints of the pics instead of digital files. It has nothing to do with submitting images to publications.

Also (and I'm not being sarcastic, just pragmatic), I would be more concerned that you want to do a session without paying a photographer (other than paying with your talent, which is fine, and what the photographer is doing as well) and then expect him or her to take their energies, time, etc., and work for you. Come off as this to me: "Well, let's shoot some pics - I don't want to pay you for the session, and if I like what we get, then you can do all the marketing work for me and I'll get noticed..."

You have to realize that there are some photographers (like myself) who have zero interest in commercial work. A model asking me to submit on her behalf would result in me having to work for nothing and I have a feeling if I told her I would do it for X-dollars, I would never hear from her again and she would start telling other models that I was trying to rip her off.

Of course, if the photographer gives you permission to submit work yourself, that's fine - then the burden of work is on you. But the photographer then has the job of keeping track of his copyright (which is different than a usage agreement) and you have gotten salable images without shelling out a dime. That may be good business for you, but photographers aren't going to do tf* with someone on that basis for very long.

IMHO

Feb 09 13 05:45 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Erlinda
Posts: 7,094
London, England, United Kingdom


Don't submit anything till you speak/ask the photographer.

Some photographers will have no problem with you asking but when you do they might have some questions for ya so make sure you have answers.

Things like this photographers should be asking,
What are the terms to submitting to the magazine? do you get credit for the work? where is the magazine published? What kind of content does it have in it? What are their audience etc etc....

Good luck
Feb 09 13 06:01 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
AJ_In_Atlanta
Posts: 12,775
Atlanta, Georgia, US


ChiMo wrote:

If you want to see yourself published in print, then work with photographers that already submit and actually get printed already. That will NOT be easy! It is so very hard to get printed. The magazines are getting bombarded with stuff daily. The guys getting printed are getting bombarded by models, MUAs etc looking to collaborate.

BTW, the "P" in TFP may stand for "print", yes. But it means a print of the photo. NOT a guarantee of an editorial print.

Blogs are a little more realistic. But again, work with guys that already are on that path.

QFT

Feb 09 13 06:15 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Harold Rose
Posts: 2,925
Calhoun, Georgia, US


Alyssa Sky wrote:
Hey models...and or photographers...this is just a simple question. Now, don't be all sarcastic and troll like or get angry with this question, because I just don't know: Is it too forward to ask a photographer to submit their work to magazines/blogs? In my experience, TFP means TFpicturesforyourfacebookpage. However, I would prefer the P. Which stands for PRINT. Would a photographer get offended if you asked them to submit their photos to magazines? How about if you submitted their work for them? Thanks guys, appreciate the responses!

You bring up a whole  pile of things that are just not done..  The working agreement between the two of you should be the  guideline.  IT SOUNDS LIKE YOU SURE NEED AN AGREEMENT..

Feb 09 13 06:26 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Jeffrey M Fletcher
Posts: 4,344
Asheville, North Carolina, US


Some photographers wouldn't like it, but some would be real happy if you wanted to do that for them. Just talk to the individual photographer.
Feb 09 13 06:55 am  Link  Quote 
guide forum
Photographer
Rays Fine Art
Posts: 6,176
New York, New York, US


Would a photographer get offended if you asked them to submit their photos to magazines?
        I would think that most would be flattered.

How about if you submitted their work for them?
        Big No-No.  Besides, no reputable magazine would not accept such a
        submission without your guarantee that you own the copyright, which you
        don't and the photographer almost certainly won't sell to you anyway.  Much
        better to stick with plan A.

All IMHO as always, of course.
Feb 09 13 07:46 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Francisco Castro
Posts: 1,708
Cincinnati, Ohio, US


If a model I've worked with wants to submit an image to a publication, I am fine with it, as long as she tells me before she does. No telling me after it gets accepted, because I will inform the magazine that I do not consent just out of principle.

Also the model has to agree that only images that have NOT BEEN POSTED OR SHARED ANYWHERE (including Facebook) are to be submitted. Most magazines require only original unpublished unseen work to preserve their sense of exclusivity.

I also like to check the fine print of a magazine's submission guidlines. All too often, there is a "rights grab" clause that states, " If a photo is submitted, there is no guarantee it will make it to print, but it does constitute a transfer of ownership and copyright with no further compensation other than consideration for printing the image in the magazine.". In other words, they get the pic to do whatever with, including selling it to third parties, and you get nothing.

Models are way too eager to do this, because they have nothing to lose, while the photographer gives away any rights to the image.
Feb 09 13 08:03 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Volition Graphics
Posts: 426
Seattle, Washington, US


I wouldn't be offended if asked.

It would be best to discuss this prior to shooting though. And depending on your relationship with the photographer, it doesn't hurt to ask afterwards either.

Note keyword:  ask  wink
Feb 09 13 08:04 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Abbitt Photography
Posts: 11,587
Oakland Acres, Iowa, US


Alyssa Sky wrote:
... Is it too forward to ask a photographer to submit their work to magazines/blogs?

I think people are misreading this. It doesn't sound to me as if she's wanting to submit photos herself, but have the photographer submit photos to get a tear.

Just speaking for myself - Most of the TF shoots I do, are not going to produce images that any magazine is likely to select and publish by random submission.

If you want a tear, I think your chances are better by finding a photographer who is shooting specifically with the goal of producing images for publication.

Feb 09 13 08:05 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
afplcc
Posts: 5,998
Fairfax, Virginia, US


Alyssa Sky wrote:
Hey models...and or photographers...this is just a simple question. Now, don't be all sarcastic and troll like or get angry with this question, because I just don't know: Is it too forward to ask a photographer to submit their work to magazines/blogs? In my experience, TFP means TFpicturesforyourfacebookpage. However, I would prefer the P. Which stands for PRINT. Would a photographer get offended if you asked them to submit their photos to magazines? How about if you submitted their work for them? Thanks guys, appreciate the responses!

Alyssa,

First, "TFP" the "P" for "print" typically meant "prints" rather than a CD with images (or downloads).  Not tearsheets or actually published work.

Second, as others have mentioned, TF is what you make of it.  I've had some models where they wanted a piece of clothing I had or they'd shoot but they wanted poses at the waterfall my avatar is at.  Or they said they'd shoot but they wanted to include a specific concept.  Or I had to bring "power berries" as a snack and she got to keep what was left (go to Trader Joe's and you'll know what I mean). 

Third, if you saw edits and really loved what you say, I don't think a photographer would be offended if you said "Wow, Ed, these are just freaking amazing--I love these shots.  I know an outlet that would jump at the chance to print these.  Are you interested?  I can connect you to the arts director for the magazine."  But ultimately, unless you have a usage agreement that says otherwise, the photographer (at least here in the States) owns the publication rights (assuming you signed a model release).

Now, if you contacted me and said "Ed, I'd really like to get some of our shots in print.  Please start contacting magazines and print outlets to see who would use them" then yeah, I'd be annoyed.  Unless I have existing contacts interested in that work or some art directors that owe me, it's going to involve some work on my part.

Ed

Feb 09 13 08:05 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Paolo Diavolo
Posts: 8,530
Martinez, California, US


-The Dave- wrote:
Wrong. She does not hold copyright so she can NOT authorize someone else's images to be used.

The photographer can submit if he/she wants.

^ this.
I've had to sign 2 copyright related documents this week with magazines in regards to my work being published.

Alyssa,
If you have posed for images you'd like to have in Magazines, You can submit them for the photographer (copyright holder), just ask the photographer before to clarify they will sign the release paperwork if the images are accepted.
In some cases this means handing over copyright entirely to the publication.

Feb 09 13 08:11 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
salvatori.
Posts: 3,804
State College, Pennsylvania, US


Abbitt Photography wrote:
I think people are misreading this. It doesn't sound to me as if she's wanting to submit photos herself, but have the photographer submit photos to get a tear.

Uh, read her entire post...

"Hey models...and or photographers...this is just a simple question. Now, don't be all sarcastic and troll like or get angry with this question, because I just don't know: Is it too forward to ask a photographer to submit their work to magazines/blogs? In my experience, TFP means TFpicturesforyourfacebookpage. However, I would prefer the P. Which stands for PRINT. Would a photographer get offended if you asked them to submit their photos to magazines? How about if you (meaning 'her') submitted their work for them? Thanks guys, appreciate the responses!"

Feb 09 13 08:15 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Jersey Shore
Posts: 403
Tinton Falls, New Jersey, US


Alyssa Sky wrote:
Hey models...and or photographers...this is just a simple question. Now, don't be all sarcastic and troll like or get angry with this question, because I just don't know: Is it too forward to ask a photographer to submit their work to magazines/blogs? In my experience, TFP means TFpicturesforyourfacebookpage. However, I would prefer the P. Which stands for PRINT. Would a photographer get offended if you asked them to submit their photos to magazines? How about if you submitted their work for them? Thanks guys, appreciate the responses!

in your experience, TFP means TFpicturesforyourfacebookpage?
i certainly would love to know where you got your experience from, because i have never heard of that explanation of TFP before. i guess you learn something new on MM every day.

when did Facebook have anything to do with TF shoots?

Feb 09 13 08:20 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Looknsee Photography
Posts: 21,381
Portland, Oregon, US


Alyssa Sky wrote:
Hey models...and or photographers...this is just a simple question. Now, don't be all sarcastic and troll like or get angry with this question, because I just don't know: Is it too forward to ask a photographer to submit their work to magazines/blogs? In my experience, TFP means TFpicturesforyourfacebookpage. However, I would prefer the P. Which stands for PRINT. Would a photographer get offended if you asked them to submit their photos to magazines? How about if you submitted their work for them? Thanks guys, appreciate the responses!

In my opinion, there is absolutely no up-side to submitting photos to magazines:

...  They never pay.  I hate that the magazine profits but I don't.  Makes me
     feel exploited.
...  The so-called "exposure" is worthless.
...  I try to network locally, where it matters most.
...  The magazine crops images and often reproduces images poorly.
...  It hurts when the photographs are rejected.
...  The print media is dying.
...  My aesthetics rarely align with the magazine's.
...  etc.

So, no -- I am not interested in submitting to magazines.

Feb 09 13 08:25 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
M Pandolfo Photography
Posts: 12,116
Tampa, Florida, US


Alyssa Sky wrote:
Hey models...and or photographers...this is just a simple question. Now, don't be all sarcastic and troll like or get angry with this question, because I just don't know: Is it too forward to ask a photographer to submit their work to magazines/blogs? In my experience, TFP means TFpicturesforyourfacebookpage. However, I would prefer the P. Which stands for PRINT. Would a photographer get offended if you asked them to submit their photos to magazines? How about if you submitted their work for them? Thanks guys, appreciate the responses!

The "P" for Print means a hard copy print of an image. Not "IN print" as in published. Otherwise it would be Trade for Publication.

Are you asking if it would be okay to ask a photographer to submit the images that he/she took of you to a publication? Of course it's ok to ask, but I'm not really getting what the endgame is here other than you'd like to have images of yourself published.

If the photographer thinks the work is publication-worthy they submit the images on spec, but that's no guarantee of being published. Far from it. And if the photographer is shooting with the backing of a publication you'd know going in and it probably wouldn't be done on a TF* basis.

But, no, never submit somebody else's work to a publication. The images may be OF you but they are the property of the person who created them.

Feb 09 13 08:27 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
M Pandolfo Photography
Posts: 12,116
Tampa, Florida, US


Jersey Shore wrote:

in your experience, TFP means TFpicturesforyourfacebookpage?
i certainly would love to know where you got your experience from, because i have never heard of that explanation of TFP before. i guess you learn something new on MM every day.

when did Facebook have anything to do with TF shoots?

I think what she meant is that the end usage of most images done on a TF* basis are nothing more than Facebook fodder.

What are most models doing with the images they get? They're uploading them somewhere and that's the extent of the image usage.

She was saying she'd like the images to actually be used for something productive that means something, not just being the next avatar on Facebook. I understand what she's saying it's just not as easy as, "Hey, I want this shot published."

Feb 09 13 08:30 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Camerosity
Posts: 5,300
Saint Louis, Missouri, US


ChiMo wrote:
BTW, the "P" in TFP may stand for "print", yes. But it means a print of the photo. NOT a guarantee of an editorial print.

How true. A photographer can't guarantee publication. Only an editor or publisher can do that. Most won't, because they like to keep their options open until the issue goes to press. And those who do guarantee reserve the right to change their minds - whether they say so or not.

Even Alfred Eisenstaedt, who was a staffer at LIFE magazine during its prime and was arguably the best magazine photojournalist of all time, couldn't guarantee publication. It's in one of his books.

There was a forum thread about a year ago that was started by a photographer who did guarantee publication. An editor had looked at the model's portfolio and said he'd publish a set of photos of her before they were shot. But he didn't. Probably partly because the photographer used the photos in his portfolio before submmitting them to the magazine (and partly because the photos weren't very good).

Most magazines won't use anything that has been published before - and that goes for photos used in a public portfolio. (Many will allow placing the photos on the net with controlled access, like a password-protected folder on MM.)

Since most magazines work six months ahead (many are working on August issues now), most photos intended for publication will be in limbo for portfolio use for six months - or longer.

Feb 09 13 03:08 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
MC Photo
Posts: 4,144
New York, New York, US


Alyssa Sky wrote:
Hey llamas...and or photographers...this is just a simple question. Now, don't be all sarcastic and troll like or get angry with this question, because I just don't know: Is it too forward to ask a photographer to submit their work to magazines/blogs? In my experience, TFP means TFpicturesforyourfacebookpage. However, I would prefer the P. Which stands for PRINT. Would a photographer get offended if you asked them to submit their photos to magazines? How about if you submitted their work for them? Thanks guys, appreciate the responses!

TFP used to mean trade for PRINTS, not PRINT. It was back before digital. It doesn't mean trade to have photos published.

Feb 09 13 07:42 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Jay Bowman
Posts: 6,511
Atlanta, Georgia, US


Camerosity wrote:
How true. A photographer can't guarantee publication. Only an editor or publisher can do that. Most won't, because they like to keep their options open until the issue goes to press. And those who do guarantee reserve the right to change their minds - whether they say so or not.

Even Alfred Eisenstaedt, who was a staffer at LIFE magazine during its prime and was arguably the best magazine photojournalist of all time, couldn't guarantee publication. It's in one of his books.

There was a forum thread about a year ago that was started by a photographer who did guarantee publication. An editor had looked at the model's portfolio and said he'd publish a set of photos of her before they were shot. But he didn't. Probably partly because the photographer used the photos in his portfolio before submmitting them to the magazine (and partly because the photos weren't very good).

Most magazines won't use anything that has been published before - and that goes for photos used in a public portfolio. (Many will allow placing the photos on the net with controlled access, like a password-protected folder on MM.)

Since most magazines work six months ahead (many are working on August issues now), most photos intended for publication will be in limbo for portfolio use for six months - or longer.

There's a lot of info in here worth seeing again.

Magazines like to feel like they're ahead of the curve (even when they aren't) so that means they want exclusive content. Or, at the very least, be the first to put certain content out. If it's out of MM and Facebook and Instagram and Tumblr… a magazine isn't going to want that content.

Feb 09 13 09:05 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Camerosity
Posts: 5,300
Saint Louis, Missouri, US


Jay Bowman wrote:
There's a lot of info in here worth seeing again.

Magazines like to feel like they're ahead of the curve (even when they aren't) so that means they want exclusive content. Or, at the very least, be the first to put certain content out. If it's out of MM and Facebook and Instagram and Tumblr… a magazine isn't going to want that content.

Or, as a magazine editor explained it several years ago, he dislikes receiving phone calls, emails, letters and postcards from readers asking why they're paying to see photos they've already seen somewhere else.

And he dislikes it even more if the note is scribbled on a renewal statement that's returned without a check or a credit card number.

Feb 10 13 05:53 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Aaron Lewis Photography
Posts: 5,083
Catskill, New York, US


Ya know, I think there should be a single resource here on MM, written by a lawyer from each state in the union to cover this topic.

The whole copyright issue is always being brought up, everyone has read something different and interpreted differently. Does anyone REALLY know what the law actually is?

The way I understand it is the artist has exclusive copyright to his work at the moment of creation. In our case the photographers own exclusive copyright the moment the shutter is released for ever expanding to 70 years past their death.

No the model or subject has rights depending on what the release say, BUT without a release the subject has the right to proper representation. That's to say as long as the photographer doesn't degrade or portray the model in a negative light, they have the right to use however they want.

The model CAN NOT use the images in any way other than what's stated in the release or agreement. If there is no agreement the model has no right to use the images for anything other than their own viewing.

Now, who says different and can you show me a legal document that says so. Yes I know we've done this before but lets do it again for the sake of clarity.


-The Dave- wrote:
TFWhatever is whatever you agree on it to be.

Exactly. It's Trade For what ever you agree to trade. If you want it to be prints then trade for print and get it in writing. I don't care if it's TF, fun, test whatever if you expect to receive something more than attending the shoot, get it in writing.

Feb 10 13 08:28 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Camerosity
Posts: 5,300
Saint Louis, Missouri, US


Aaron Lewis Photography wrote:
Ya know, I think there should be a single resource here on MM, written by a lawyer from each state in the union to cover this topic.

The whole copyright issue is always being brought up, everyone has read something different and interpreted differently. Does anyone REALLY know what the law actually is?

In the US copyright is a federal issue, period. The states have no jurisdiction in copyright issues. It’s usage of the photos that varies from state to state.

The US Copyright Office has several tutorials regarding copyright on its web site.

http://copyright.gov/

ASMP (the American Society of Media Photographers, formerly the American Society of Magazine Photographers) has several tutorials on copyright including this one. The table of contents for copyright is to the right of the page.

http://asmp.org/content/registration-counts

While it has been updated from time to time, ASMP’s standard model release form for adults (and another one for minors) has been an industry standard for publication since the 1950’s. They have tutorials on model releases as well – but I’m sure it’s impossible to cover every single hypothetical situation.

http://asmp.org/tutorials/adults-model-release.html

Some states have “right of publicity” laws that deal with model releases and other related issues. In other states (as well as these) applicable laws may be scattered throughout the statute book.

http://rightofpublicity.com/

As mentioned above, Carolyn Wright, who specializes in legal issues that affect photographers, has a book on the subject (although it’s a few years old and doesn’t cover changes in the law that have occurred since it was published), and her web site also has some tutorials.

http://www.photoattorney.com/

Some intellectual property lawyers and law firms have blogs on copyright, usage and other related issues.

If you’re in the US, and you can’t find the answer to your question from these sources, you need to talk to an intellectual property attorney. In many other cases that wouldn’t be a bad idea anyway.

Feb 10 13 01:57 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
intense_puppy
Posts: 864
Brighton, England, United Kingdom


Alyssa Sky wrote:
Is it too forward to ask a photographer to submit their work to magazines/blogs? In my experience, TFP means TFpicturesforyourfacebookpage. However, I would prefer the P. Which stands for PRINT. Would a photographer get offended if you asked them to submit their photos to magazines?

Not too forward at all. Never hurts to ask.

Alyssa Sky wrote:
How about if you submitted their work for them?

I wouldn't mind this, but we'd need to agree first. Randomly submitting without telling me is bad form smile

Feb 10 13 02:00 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Aaron Lewis Photography
Posts: 5,083
Catskill, New York, US


No wonder we have lawyers. Whenever I have an issue I just ask the PPA for help.
Feb 10 13 06:15 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Camerosity
Posts: 5,300
Saint Louis, Missouri, US


Aaron Lewis Photography wrote:
No wonder we have lawyers. Whenever I have an issue I just ask the PPA for help.

And you could easily spend more than your PPofA dues getting a question answered by a lawyer.

Feb 10 13 10:16 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Aaron Lewis Photography
Posts: 5,083
Catskill, New York, US


Camerosity wrote:
And you could easily spend more than your PPofA dues getting a question answered by a lawyer.

Absolutely. Now I will say I've never actually had to take legal action other than a few letters from me and PPA stating our intent. But I will say they were there to back me up.  I know a lot of people don't see the value in organizations like PPA and I'm sure I don't use half the benefits available but it's worth every penny when you need someone.

Feb 11 13 06:07 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Farenell Photography
Posts: 18,022
Albany, New York, US


You can ask.

But unless you're willing to do the legwork on where to send them, pay for the postage, pay for the cost of print, pay for the oversized envelopes to mail them in, among other things, I wouldn't get your hopes up.
Feb 11 13 06:28 am  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Star
Posts: 17,941
Los Angeles, California, US


Alyssa Sky wrote:
Hey models...and or photographers...this is just a simple question. Now, don't be all sarcastic and troll like or get angry with this question, because I just don't know: Is it too forward to ask a photographer to submit their work to magazines/blogs? In my experience, TFP means TFpicturesforyourfacebookpage. However, I would prefer the P. Which stands for PRINT. Would a photographer get offended if you asked them to submit their photos to magazines? How about if you submitted their work for them? Thanks guys, appreciate the responses!

I have had so many models ask me to shoot them and then get them in LA Weekly or pasadena magazine. It is one of my pet peeves. Don't do it.

from my profile

How to get a tear sheet from a shoot with Star

In the last three years I have shot over 30 covers for publications, and about 90 editorial stories. ALL of those have been commissioned work, and all of them have had specific criteria attached.

The way this works is on Tuesday I get a call from so and so from such and such publication. They outline the story and 75% of the time already know who I am shooting for the story, because the story is about that person. The other 20% of the time I am given a prospective- that is where the art director wants something very specific (a brunette business couple to pose with Mosh, or a blonde with tattoos on her hands etc...) and I either approach a model I know and have worked with in the past, or I call an agency and then submit the models to the AD for them to approve the one(s) they want to book.

5% of the time it is a real time crunch and I post up a casting call.

All in all, from initial phone call to booking the models it is usually between 2-24 hours.

This means that i can not be "hired" to shoot a model, or book a make-up artist, for a cover shoot because that is just not how it works. Please do not contact me about trying to get on the cover of the LA Weekly or any other publication I have worked for in the past, it just doesn't work that way.

thankyou

Feb 11 13 01:15 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Velvet Paper Photo
Posts: 468
Lexington, Kentucky, US


Alyssa Sky wrote:
Hey models...and or photographers...this is just a simple question. Now, don't be all sarcastic and troll like or get angry with this question, because I just don't know: Is it too forward to ask a photographer to submit their work to magazines/blogs? In my experience, TFP means TFpicturesforyourfacebookpage. However, I would prefer the P. Which stands for PRINT. Would a photographer get offended if you asked them to submit their photos to magazines? How about if you submitted their work for them? Thanks guys, appreciate the responses!

I would ask the photographer if they minded. They may have to submit it for you depending on the website/mag terms. I know I wouldn't mind, but would prefer to submit them for you.

Feb 11 13 01:20 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Art Silva
Posts: 9,378
Santa Barbara, California, US


If a model came to me to submit photos we shot to a magazine I would,
#1 be flattered
#2 be suspicious to What magazine.

Before saying yes or no i would want to know what the photos are for, how they will be used, what kind of licensing is in play and read their ToS. The last thing I want is to be blind sided and have my photos passed around in the publishing circles with out any compensation because I didn't read the fine print of the release... I had this happen before.

Oh and btw, TFP originally meant Trade For Prints. It's from just before the digital age.
Feb 11 13 03:04 pm  Link  Quote 
Photographer
Amelia G
Posts: 559
Los Angeles, California, US


I personally love collaborating with models who have a particular magazine they want to be in. You can probably tell from my profile that has worked out well for me.

Some photographers don't like to do the things magazines require, so I'd suggest shooting with photogs who have print credits and just telling them up front, before you shoot, what your best-case outcome would be for where the pics end up.

Good luck :-)
Feb 11 13 05:44 pm  Link  Quote 
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