Art Silva wrote:

Art Silva wrote:
Most annoying thing photographers do? ^^^ that.

Disrespecting other photographers to drive their ego.

So Erlinda, are you saying I am not a "photographer"?

I don't make a living or bother to market my work yet I have been a (published) hobbyist for three decades, process my own film/print work, use darkrooms and shoot every kind of camera I can get my hands on.

By your logic I have no business making photos and calling myself a photographer if I don't shoot portrait/fashion for clients. That's ridiculous.

Getting paid to shoot digital fashion portraits does not constitute the title of photographer if you are comparing yourself to someone who is a true student of the craft in every photo medium. (like how I flipped the script there?)

The study of capturing light... That is what Photography means btw.
A photographer is one who practices photography.

That to me makes me think you are a hardcore hobbyist/artist. But you are right, in MY opinion I do not concider you a photographer.

DougBPhoto wrote:



Nice job adding the bold, but it would appear you're about 5 words too late.

Pretty much...

Erlinda wrote:
That to me makes me think you are a hardcore hobbyist/artist. But you are right, in MY opinion I do not concider you a photographer.

Wow!


So tell me, I made a good income in the past freelancing photojournalism and sports photojournalism to newspapers and magazines back in the day with the "photo by" or "contributing photographer" credits, have made some cash selling my art to art and photography buyers.
Well known curators and publishers address me as "Photographer", people who are well respected in the art and photography business.
Wedding organizers who asks for my services (which I refuse because shooting weddings is not my thing) come to me looking for me the Photographer.
I am also selected in some artnudes circles that consist of some of the most influential art photographers (some who wrote books on the subject) and models as a respectable photographer to work with.

You mean to tell me I should ignore all those people and follow your twisted definition.

Yes I've done this as a hobby since the 70s but I have been skilled enough to be considered a pro yet I do not make the business part a priority. I don't CARE to make money from it... that still doesn't change what I do with the camera and darkroom, and being a photographer.

Can you relate to that since you ARE a photographer of all photographers?

Art Silva wrote:

I see the problem, you are skipping the main (1st) primary definition. Highlighting an example is just that, an example of the person who takes photographs.
her, I' re do it and you'll see where the inflection of the definition is...

The actual definition by dictionary.com pulse oxford dictionary is

photographer
fəˈtɒgrəfə/
noun
1.
a person who takes photographs, especially as a job.
"a freelance press photographer"
synonyms:    lensman, paparazzo, documentarian;

That there means a person (= anyone) who makes photographs.

So would you NOT call a person who cooks meals for free a cook? or a hobbyist?

Because people associate photographer as in someone that makes a living out of it.

You don't see the example being. A person that takes photos for fun and loves to just experiment with light/film and darkroom do you?

I don't get why some of you are so butt hurt/frustrated with me. I'm some fucking stranger to you, you shouldn't give a flying fuck what I think you are. Move on

Erlinda wrote:
The actual definition by dictionary.com pulse oxford dictionary is

photographer
fəˈtɒgrəfə/
noun
1.
a person who takes photographs, especially as a job.
"a freelance press photographer"
synonyms:    lensman, paparazzo, documentarian;

Soooooooo I'll stick to my opinion. And you can stick to yours

DougBPhoto wrote:


Nice job adding the bold, but it would appear you're about 5 words too late.

+1

Erlinda wrote:

Because people associate photographer as in someone that makes a living out of it.

Says who? You? Because I don't.

DougBPhoto wrote:



Nice job adding the bold, but it would appear you're about 5 words too late.

I don't think I am.

P I X I E wrote:

Says who? You? Because I don't.

The same way how there are people that disagree with me there are also people that agree with me. You aren't one of them but I know many.

Art of the nude wrote:
Ironically, at the moment, I'm trying to work around the fact that the model refuses to shoot NON NUDE. 

I had that exact problem last month. The underlying issue was that she didn't like how her eyes look (they're awesome eyes in my opinion, but her opinion is the one that matters).  I hired a retoucher to get her eyes perfect in some clothed photos and all of the sudden she was happy shooting clothed. I'm guessing she figured that by shooting nude, people wouldn't pay as much attention to her eyes.  Once she was happy with the appearance of her eyes, she was happy in clothes too. **good outcome all around**

MelissaAnn  wrote:
Erlinda is incorrect, and her opinion does not change the actual definition of the word "photographer."

You're a "professional" photographer, which only means you make money/make a living off of your work.

EXACTLY!

At this point in my life, I make the majority of my money from training motorcyclists, which makes me a professional motorcyclist.
Just because my students do not earn their money the same way, it does not stop me from calling them motorcyclists... then again, I'm not one to go getting high on my own supply very often


Ahem...

World English Dictionary

photographer  (fəˈtɒɡrəfə) 
 
— n   
a person who takes photographs, either as a hobby or a profession

Erlinda wrote:
I don't think I am.

At least you're not open-minded about it

DougBPhoto wrote:

At least you're not open-minded about it

I could be, but I feel like being stubborn. Xox

Erlinda wrote:
1) Because people associate photographer as in someone that makes a living out of it.

2) You don't see the example being. A person that takes photos for fun and loves to just experiment with light/film and darkroom do you?

3) I don't get why some of you are so butt hurt/frustrated with me. I'm some fucking stranger to you, you shouldn't give a flying fuck what I think you are. Move on

1) They are STILL photographers, "people" not related to the term don't know the difference.

2) again, its the process of PHOTOGRAPHY, thus being a Phogorapher. You're equating money to being a photographer, that's only one little part of it and a side byproduct; as in a photographer who makes a living for his/her photographs.
To you does that mean a person who sells photos taken by others are photographers?... NO
Don't you shoot anything but your DSLR? if not you are not a photographer but rather a picture taker who sells pictures. Get it yet?

3) because you come into a thread and disrespect other photographers for your own benefit AND because you need to learn the proper and historical meaning of the term, we are just trying to stop you from making a fool of yourself... too late now!

ugh ANYways... sorry folks
/threadjack

Erlinda wrote:
I could be, but I feel like being stubborn. Xox

Glad I can go back to agreeing with you now!!! 

xox
oxo
oxx

Art Silva wrote:
You mean to tell me I should ignore all those people and follow your twisted definition.

Don't worry, she's just pulling your leg...

She told me earlier that she wouldn't consider me an old fart until I was at least 70!





Just my $0.02 etc. etc.

DougBPhoto wrote:
Glad I can go back to agreeing with you now!!! 

xox
oxo
oxx

I +1 that agreement 

Another Italian Guy wrote:
Don't worry, she's just pulling your leg...

She told me earlier that she wouldn't consider me an old fart until I was at least 70!

Oh good, I'm not an old fart yet either

Art Silva wrote:
1) They are STILL photographers, "people" not related to the term don't know the difference.

2) again, its the process of PHOTOGRAPHY, thus being a Phogorapher. You're equating money to being a photographer.
That means a person who sells photos taken by others are photographers... NO
Do you do shoot anything but your DSLR? if not you are not a photographer but rather a picture taker who sells pictures. Get it yet?

3) because you come into a thread and disrespect other photographers for your own benefit AND because you need to learn the proper and historical meaning of the term, we are just trying to stop you from making a fool of yourself... too late now!

ugh ANYways... sorry folks
/threadjack

If you took my joke too personally then you need thicker skin. If I disrespected someone because MY opinion hurt their feelings that is their problem and maybe they shouldn't be so sensitive to a complete stranger thoughts.

I don't need to learn from hobbyist. But thanks for your concern

P.s that was a joke ^ just incase y'all decide to get emotional on me

Erlinda wrote:
If you took my joke too personally then you need thicker skin. If I disrespected someone because MY opinion hurt their feelings that is their problem and maybe they shouldn't be so sensitive to a complete stranger thoughts.

I don't need to learn from hobbyist. But thanks for your concern

Wow, how you get thru life is a wonder with that attitude.

From one very experienced hobbyist [who probably pocketed more btw] to one rookie hobbyist... you're welcome.
No hurt here, just trying to teach.
There will be a quiz next week on this. good luck.

You're right about one thing, it's an Opinion!
... does not equal knowledge or truth.

P I X I E wrote:


This has been entertaining...

yep, fun to watch people making a fool out of themself and  see them back paddling.

Art Silva wrote:

Wow, how you get thru life is a wonder with that attitude.

From one very experienced hobbyist [who probably pocketed more btw] to one rookie hobbyist... you're welcome.
There will be a quiz next week on this. good luck.

Didn't get my joke. It's okay it's a hit or miss.

P.s I suck at test/quizs never my forte

Art Silva wrote:

Wow, how you get thru life is a wonder with that attitude.

From one very experienced hobbyist [who probably pocketed more btw] to one rookie hobbyist... you're welcome.
No hurt here, just trying to teach.
There will be a quiz next week on this. good luck.

You're right about one thing, it's an Opinion!
... does not equal knowledge or truth.

Never said it was truth or knowledge. Just a random thought/opinion I have.

Erlinda wrote:

Didn't get my joke. It's okay it's a hit or miss.

P.s I suck at test/quizs never my forte

Well that just means you have to stay after class 

yes, i just caught your joke... I knew it was anyways.

barepixels wrote:

yep, fun to watch people making a fool out of themself and  see them back paddling.

Beep, beep, beep, beep, beep!

Amadea T wrote:

Don't you concern yourself with brothels now, young man...are you studying for the quiz?

I'm an old guy. I had to study hard last week for a urine test, and now you want me to take another test.

I'm also very good with my hands, and I mean seriously good with my hands. But I have no desire to learn how to use a trach kit; sorry but too yucky for me.

Erlinda wrote:
The actual definition by dictionary.com pulse oxford dictionary is

photographer
fəˈtɒgrəfə/


noun
1.
a person who takes photographs, especially as a job.
"a freelance press photographer"
synonyms:    lensman, paparazzo, documentarian;

Soooooooo I'll stick to my opinion. And you can stick to yours

You stick right on to it Erlinda, you're still wrong, and all of the photographers here (hobbyist and otherwise) know it.  I can't believe you're still even arguing this.

Your opinion is opinion.  Fact is fact.

BTW, do you know what "especially" means?  It doesn't have the same definition as "only."  Thought you should know since it seems you're having trouble comprehending the very simple definition above. 

Erlinda wrote:

Because people associate photographer as in someone that makes a living out of it.

You don't see the example being. A person that takes photos for fun and loves to just experiment with light/film and darkroom do you?

I don't get why some of you are so butt hurt/frustrated with me. I'm some fucking stranger to you, you shouldn't give a flying fuck what I think you are. Move on

then by your account van gogh was not a painter, since he only sold one painting in his lifetime and died penniless.

Erlinda wrote:
Because people associate photographer as in someone that makes a living out of it.

No

Erlinda wrote:
I'm some fucking stranger to you, you shouldn't give a flying fuck what I think you are.

Yes

Amadea T wrote:
This is a thread derived from the 'annoying things models do' bit in the 'other' forum.

This is about model's pet peeves, not horror storries about rape and molestation.

I go first:

It is a pet peeve of mine, when the photographer keeps wanting to feed me, (upon a wrapped set, before I get ready to leave), although I repeatedly said "No, thank you."  "I am ocd about my diet." " I appreciate the effort, but I am good." "I don't eat this or that, but thank you." "I am really not hungry."

I understand that in most it's not just about the hospitality thing, and good manners, but a little father complex. "Must feed starving child."

Really, you are sweet, but please don't make me explain my whole issue about why I don't eat certain things, we'll be there for another hour.


Edit: I'd love a glass of water, all the time, every time. Please and thank you.

Damn hospitality. Always gets in the way!
On a serious note, there are some very long and tiring projects where it is REQUIRED that the people running a photoshoot FEED the participants. It is exceptional of you to run on air and water, but lots of other people need to maintain their sugar levels high, because their everyday diet keeps them ultra-thin, with very low blood-sugar levels.

PHOTOS BY DILLEN wrote:
become a nun ...then nobody will care,,,, damn those photographers for trying to be friendly

Über Dami wrote:
cute sarcasm there.  what i was trying to say was when they dig too far personally.  it's fine to ask what my style is about, questions about my piercings, things i do for fun etc.  but asking if im seeing someone is a bit personal and asking where i work is personal, asking what i do for a living is better.

People have found very similar behavior coming from people at bars, concerts, parties, weddings, etc.

Is there a pattern going on...?

I think that behavior comes from people that are interested in "hooking up" with others. It is not behavior that is exclusive to photographers.

L A U B E N H E I M E R wrote:

then by your account van gogh was not a painter, since he only sold one painting in his lifetime and died penniless.

+++

IMnPhoto wrote:
Damn hospitality. Always gets in the way!
On a serious note, there are some very long and tiring projects where it is REQUIRED that the people running a photoshoot FEED the participants. It is exceptional of you to run on air and water, but lots of other people need to maintain their sugar levels high, because their everyday diet keeps them ultra-thin, with very low blood-sugar levels.

This thread is old as dirt. OP was eons ago.

Also, I said in my op that upon wrapped shoot, not on a whole days production out in Lucerne Valley at 54 degrees in the nekkid.

There I will snarf dense calories, you won't be able to keep up!

But not in a heated studio, where I'm with a hobbyist (irrelevant, I know, don't you dare get miffed at me for that now!) for a two hour slot, who just won't let me leave cause he's not done small talking my ear off...?
I need to get the hell outta there and get ready for my next stuffs, y'all!

Also, I get this stupid baby belly I can't suck in for love nor money after just a few bites, and that's just not on.
I do know that I am not the fist gal to tell that to a photographer either btw.

Now let's move on..

Amadea T wrote:
Now let's move on..

But the party's in here!

Just Danielle wrote:
Touching me! Please don't re-arrange my arms or legs, ask me to move, please don't grab my hand to help me up when I'm done posing on the floor & most certainly don't start attempting to lift me over something. It's not right & It's not normal!!

I hope this is not the thought of all models these days is it? I can understand the concern of overstepping boundaries or touching a model without asking (disrespectful), however (and other's input sought, please) I thought that it was still gentlemanly and common courtesy to offer a hand to help a model up a steep cliff, from floor, onto landing, etc...

(I am not quipping at this model's personal boundaries to which she is entitled, but hoping such thoughts are not the generalization among the current model community)

When did common courtesy transcend into the unnormal?

MrClick Productions wrote:

I hope this is not the thought of all models these days is it? I can understand the concern of overstepping boundaries or touching a model without asking (disrespectful), however (and other's input sought, please) I thought that it was still gentlemanly and common courtesy to offer a hand to help a model up a steep cliff, from floor, onto landing, etc...

(I am not quipping at this model's personal boundaries to which she is entitled, but hoping such thoughts are not the generalization among the current model community)

When did common courtesy transcend into the unnormal?

The kind of touching I really don't like at a photoshoot is when the photographer touches me (either accidentally, on purpose, or accidentally on purpose) and then doesn't say anything about it.  I find it to be disrespectful.  I did a shoot years ago where the photographer touched me a shitload, constantly, but he explained in detail that he needed to do that because he had very specific ideas about what he wanted.  He said he needed to "mold" my hands in particular to exactly what he wanted.  My then husband was present during this shoot (he had to drive me there--it was at least a two hour long drive) so I didn't mind.  The guy got some great shots that I used for years on my modeling resume, so no problem.

When I model for art classes, the instructors always tell me that they are approaching me!  They'll say things like "I'm just walking around behind you, and is it alright if I point out a shadow on your leg?"  They're very, very respectful.

Erlinda wrote:
The actual definition by dictionary.com pulse oxford dictionary is

photographer
fəˈtɒgrəfə/


noun
1.
a person who takes photographs, especially as a job.
"a freelance press photographer"
synonyms:    lensman, paparazzo, documentarian;

Forget photographer - I'm a lensman!

Jupiter Red  wrote:
I HATE THIS SENTENCE STRUCTURE SOOOOO SOOO MUCH. Exp:

Hi....I wanted to set up a shoot with you.
Love your work...
Curious about what...we would create together.
Let me know...
Love your work, beautiful...


Serioulsy the creepiest thing ever.
"...." Devils work.
Seriously why?
I feel like you're plotting my murder.

Pet peeves :

1. When the same photog messages me repeatedly, asking to shoot on a tf basis
After I've politely explained I don't wana shoot tf with you.
Starting a new convo thread will not cause amnesia
I remember you dude.

2. Feeling the need to tell me what I can/ cannot do.
"You're only 5'8, just shoot nudes." I don't recall asking for your opinion. Kiss my ass.

3. Fashion photogs who contact me for "secret" tf nude projects, and then refuse to shoot clothed work with me. You don't deserve my nakedness.

4. Pet names
I'm not your babe, sweetie, babygirl, angel, chocolate drop

5. Calling me Chocolate kiss
6. Calling me Chocolate dream
7. Calling me Chocolate
Like dude, I'm black,that shit is weird.

8. "Grrrr" Seriously I have had photogs (growl?) at me.
Why in the holy hell would you make that sound at me.
I hope you choke.

9. There is a difference btw wanting me to play a "role" in a shoot
And tryna turn it into a personal fantasy.
Yes we can shoot a sexy school girl shoot.
No I will not be "your" sexy school girl .

Ugh so glad to get this stuff off my chest

Can we all appreciate how hilarious I am?

udor wrote:
{snip}

Following this thread for a while... I am just wondering... does a long laundry list of things that a model is being annoyed by an indicator of being a high maintenance model/diva, or... modiva?

I like "dimodel", as in "Did dimodel arrive yet?

But seriously, a high percentage of models are serious and ready to work, just gotta find them.

And with different personalities, tastes, humor, etc., It would do a photographer good to brush up on interacting with different personalities in the best way possible, so fun is had by all.

I've seen a few shoots turn around from quiet and "crickets" in the beginning, to enthusiastic, after just a few well placed words and ideas, and showing the model some shots on the LCD.

CHAD ALAN wrote:
But seriously, a high percentage of models are serious and ready to work, just gotta find them.

And with different personalities, tastes, humor, etc., It would do a photographer good to brush up on interacting with different personalities in the best way possible, so fun is had by all.

Why don't I come on out there and we'll do an instructional video to that avail?