StrawberryImages wrote:
I have scheduled to meet two 16 year old models. They cannot sign model release and their parents are not going to be at the shoot.

They asked me for an outdoor, casual shoot. Can I go ahead and shoot them outdoors, in fact, at the State Park.

I have read that it is better to avoid photographing minors but what is the law if I am not posting the images on my portfolio and it is all casual.

Seek advise from the photography community.

Kahn

Well it is like this.  How are you benefiting from shooting them  or what is the upside?  What is the possible downside.  Without knowing your age I believe the downside out weighs the upside.  Their parents can make your life a living hell or the young girls could if they want.  You are asking for trouble.

StrawberryImages wrote:
They cannot sign model release

Model release required, no shoot.

JWB wrote:
Man,  If the parents saw your portfolio you would be in deep shit.  Two nudes.

Yes better build another port for nude shoot given some parents are paranoid.
On the contrary they could think that you want shoot their child nude despite isn' true.

StrawberryImages wrote:
I have scheduled to meet two 16 year old models. They cannot sign model release and their parents are not going to be at the shoot.

They asked me for an outdoor, casual shoot. Can I go ahead and shoot them outdoors, in fact, at the State Park.

I have read that it is better to avoid photographing minors but what is the law if I am not posting the images on my portfolio and it is all casual.

Seek advise from the photography community.

Kahn

the only thing i would strongly suggest is to make sure the parents know youre going to be shooting the kids.

maybe even send a copy of a minor model release form through email, and outline what kind of photos you'll be taking.

communication is key.

i shoot minors all the time, no big deal.
however, typically a parent is present or in the odd case where a parent is not, its usually not the first time i've shot with the minor, and i've always talked with or met a parent before.

if you have suspicions that someone might make a false claim against you its best to avoid the shoot entirely, regardless of the persons age.

take special precautions, but dont let it deter you from the job.
as long as you talk to the parents first it should be ok.

if youre in a state park be prepared for some ranger to come up and ask for your permit. :p

i'm local to SF so if you need anything else let me know.

JWB wrote:
I don't get it.  99 percent are saying go for it but take precautions.  Why is it so important to shoot 16 year olds when he can't use their pictures in his portfolio.  Gee isn't there any 18 year olds that model anywhere.

EXACTLY I DONT GET YOUR LOGIC IT EITHER !
PLENTY OF ADULTS YES , but The minors aren't ASKING for SEXUAL IMAGES,
why wouldn't you shoot minors? what is wrong ? why so against it ? it isn't as if they were the Plague .
I shoot them all the time.
The only people who have issues are the ones who cant comprehend that Females CAN be Photographed with out it have to have any type of Sexual nature involved .

And what does his Age have anything to do with it?
  Man you are typing as if he is about to commit a freakin Crime against Humanity sheesh dude Lighten up !


People shoot kids them all the time MM is the ONLY frakin PLACE I KNOW OF WHERE PEOPLE FREAK OUT ABOUT THIS !

ESCALANTE wrote:
EXACTLY I DONT GET YOUR LOGIC IT EITHER !
PLENTY OF ADULTS YES , but The minors aren't ASKING for SEXUAL IMAGES,
why wouldn't you shoot minors? what is wrong ? why so against it ? it isn't as if they were the Plague .
I shoot them all the time.
The only people who have issues are the ones who cant comprehend that Females CAN be Photographed with out it have to have any type of Sexual nature involved .

And what does his Age have anything to do with it?
  Man you are typing as if he is about to commit a freakin Crime against Humanity sheesh dude Lighten up !


People shoot kids them all the time MM is the ONLY frakin PLACE I KNOW OF WHERE PEOPLE FREAK OUT ABOUT THIS !

Maybe my last comment was off base. The facts are why risk getting into trouble when you do not have to.  You live in a different world than most photographers on this site.  You have a reputation that has been earned.  We don't.  I do not understand why someone would shoot someone with any benefit to himself. 

Morally I do not think there is a thing wrong with it.  It is just the fact that we have to deal with people who will sue you or have you arrested at the drop of a hat.  You are right age has nothing to do with it.  I was wrong to ask but I needed a frame of reference.  Shoot he may be 15 year old  and that would make a big difference.

alessandro2009 wrote:
JWB you can use minor shoot on your port (see how many shoot of minor are present).
They are model, only need avoid some shoot (as for example nude), isn't a big issue.

He said he was not going to use them on his portfolio.

JWB wrote:

Maybe my last comment was off base the the facts are why risk getting into trouble when you do not have to.  You live in a different world than most photographers on this site.  You have a reputation that has been earned.  We don't I do not understand why someone would shoot someone with any benefit to himself. 

Morally I do not think their is a thing wrong with it.  It is just the fact that we have to deal with people who will sue you or have you arrested at the drop of a hat.  You are right age has nothing to do with it.  I was wrong to ask but I needed a frame of reference.  Shoot he may be 15 year old  and that would make a big difference.

Dude it is called BEING CAREFUL . WHY DOES ANYONE DO ANYTHING ?
You are coming across as if it was some dreaded act that would RUIN him.
How do You think I earned My rep ? 
BEING PROFESSIONAL AT ALL TIMES WHEN SHOOOTING ,
BE IT MONORS OR ADULTS.

JWB wrote:

He said he was not going to use them on his portfolio.

BIG DEAL !!!
OMG SEE THIS IS WHAT I MEAN !

lol wow chill out ! I have TONS OF SHIT I HAVE SHOT THAT ISNT IN MY BOOK !
I shot it because I WANTED TO ... It is part of being a photographer ...

JWB wrote:
He said he was not going to use them on his portfolio.

Well is a free choice, i don't think that everyone post all the own shoot here on MM.

ESCALANTE wrote:
BIG DEAL !!!
OMG SEE THIS IS WHAT I MEAN !

lol wow chill out ! I have TONS OF SHIT I HAVE SHOT THAT ISNT IN MY BOOK !
I shot it because I WANTED TO ... It is part of being a photographer ...

I just made something clear to the other poster.  I am chilled out.  Please don't shoot me.    He said it not me.

ESCALANTE wrote:

Dude it is called BEING CAREFUL . WHY DOES ANYONE DO ANYTHING ?
You are coming across as if it was some dreaded act that would RUIN him.
How do You think I earned My rep ? 
BEING PROFESSIONAL AT ALL TIMES WHEN SHOOOTING ,
BE IT MONORS OR ADULTS.

Okay I agree with what you are saying.  What if they did not tell mom and dad where they were going or who they were going to be with.   Dad is a preacher or a red neck or something.  It is his only daughter.  They don't answer their cell phones and get gets late.  I still say avoid it.

Paolo Diavolo wrote:
haha the situation really isnt that complicated.

1. have some sort of communication with the parents.

2. remember to keep interactions with the models professional and age appropriate.

3. provided you follow 1. and 2. you are at no more risk for false claims of he said/she said BS than with adult models.

The key is communication.  I am just speculating because the OP has said nothing.  Shit it may be the daughter of his bowling buddy.

JWB wrote:
Okay I agree with what you are saying.  What if they did not tell mom and dad where they were going or who they were going to be with.   Dad is a preacher or a red neck or something.  It is his only daughter.  They don't answer their cell phones and get gets late.  I still say avoid it.

What if the Sky Falls ?
What IF The Hubble Falls on You ?
What if  .....?

a lil paranoid ?

DUDE IT IS CALLED TAKING PRECAUTIONS ,  ARE you NOT seeing what people are TYPING OUT
?

He is ASKING for Advice in this Regard , he is getting it . You are freaking out about WHAT IF 's 
ANYTHING can happen IT IS CALLED LIFE !

lol
I am out of here , like talking to a brick wall lol !

ESCALANTE wrote:

What if the Sky Falls ?
What IF The Hubble Falls on You ?
What if  .....?

a lil paranoid ?

DUDE IT IS CALLED TAKING PRECAUTIONS ,  ARE you NOT seeing what people are TYPING OUT
?

He is ASKING for Advice in this Regard , he is getting it . You are freaking out about WHAT IF 's 
ANYTHING can happen IT IS CALLED LIFE !

lol
I am out of here , like talking to a brick wall lol !

To find the truth there must be an opposing thought and the truth will lay in the middle.

Sara Lund wrote:
what do you expect to get from the shoot if you wont use the pictures in your port ?

Sara MM is a big forum but is only a very small port of the world
The OP ask simply advice, nothing more nothing less, isn't a matter to post on MM or not.

alessandro2009 wrote:

Sara MM is a big forum but is only a very small port of the world
The OP ask simply advice, nothing more nothing less, isn't a matter to post on MM or not.

If you think these questions are to much you should hear what my wife would ask if our daughter was going to get pictures taken.

JWB wrote:
Man,  If the parents saw your portfolio you would be in deep shit.  Two nudes.

I thought this after I commented above...

JWB wrote:
If you think these questions are to much you should hear what my wife would ask if our daughter was going to get pictures taken.

Unfortunately i hear a lot more of what i like hear.
There are a lot of fantastic minor with a lot of potential don't expressed thanks to apprehensive parents.
There is a lot paranoia.
See the ton of snapshoot present everywhere on the web.
It's a pity.

alessandro2009 wrote:

Unfortunately i hear a lot more of what i like hear.
There are a lot of fantastic minor with a lot of potential don't expressed thanks to apprehensive parents.
There is a lot paranoia.
See the ton of snapshoot present everywhere on the web.
It's a pity.

I agree.  With the parent behind the child the young models have great potential.  From what I understand Europeans are not as uptight as americans about these matters.

JWB wrote:
From what I understand Europeans are not as uptight as americans about these matters.

A little less but don't think that here is the heaven.

ESCALANTE wrote:

What if the Sky Falls ?
What IF The Hubble Falls on You ?
What if  .....?

a lil paranoid ?

DUDE IT IS CALLED TAKING PRECAUTIONS ,  ARE you NOT seeing what people are TYPING OUT
?

He is ASKING for Advice in this Regard , he is getting it . You are freaking out about WHAT IF 's 
ANYTHING can happen IT IS CALLED LIFE !

lol
I am out of here , like talking to a brick wall lol !

Wow. It's pretty obvious that somebody here needs to chill out.

StrawberryImages wrote:
I have scheduled to meet two 16 year old models. They cannot sign model release and their parents are not going to be at the shoot.

They asked me for an outdoor, casual shoot. Can I go ahead and shoot them outdoors, in fact, at the State Park.

I have read that it is better to avoid photographing minors but what is the law if I am not posting the images on my portfolio and it is all casual.

Seek advise from the photography community.

Kahn

I would just pass on it myself